RedPubPod #053 Angela Leigh Tattoos, Tacos and Time

[00:00:02] What you want, when you want it, where you want it. This is the MESH. This is RedPubPod. Let her fly. RedPubPod. That's great. A podcast from RedHawk Publications. RedPubPod. Welcome to RedPubPod. I'm Richard Eller and along with me today is our Editor-in-Chief, Patty Thompson.

[00:00:27] And joining us also is our new, not really new, you've been through classes a couple times, right, Naria? Yes. Yeah. Naria Deckard who teaches our creative writing class with RedHog Publications. And so we can put in a plug for that. But the real reason we're here is for our newest writer to the RedHog Publications family, Angela Leigh. Welcome. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Talk to us first about your book. How did it come about, Tattoos, Tacos and Time?

[00:00:57] It is a collection of poetry that I had been working on for six, maybe seven years. I was at a reading and someone had asked me if I had anything published and I was like, no, I don't. And then somebody else asked me if I had anything published and I said, no, I don't. And so then I got the wheels turning and I was like, let me see. And I knew Patty from several lives before this.

[00:01:26] And so I reached out to Patty and I was like, what are the submission processes and guidelines? And then we just went through the process and she was kind enough to like it and want to publish it. Certainly somebody asking you if you've written is a good impetus to write or if you've already been writing to get it published, right? Yes, yes, yes. And that's a really good thought because there are several people out there I know that are not published. And every once in a while people say, are you published or why aren't you published?

[00:01:56] And the fact that you picked up on that, if enough people are asking you, maybe you have something going on. So note to folks out there, if people are asking if you're published and you're not, time to get your manuscript together. Right. I mean, it was definitely one of the encouraging factors because I had been writing for years and I had been reading at open mic events and different things. And to be asked multiple times at the same event was, yeah, it's kind of a red flag.

[00:02:24] And you've organized them before too, like at your old bookstore, Adventure Bound. You held the readings there too. Yes, and always a wonderful opportunity to get together anytime you can to hear other poets. And yeah, so I enjoyed organizing open mics as well. I want to talk a little bit about Adventure Bound because that's an interesting, I have known Angela of full transparency.

[00:02:52] She and I used to work together with another institution years ago. And it's just so funny, never burn bridges, another note for folks out there. Because I've known Angela for so long and when I found out she owned a bookstore at the time in Morganton, North Carolina, I was thrilled. And it was such a cool vibe. What you had going on there was amazing. Thank you. So to me, it's like it's a journey from someone who owned a bookstore to now publishing a book. That's a little unusual, but it's awesome.

[00:03:20] I mean, I know a lot of people who have written books who now own bookstores. What type of journey was this for you? And you know bookstores back and forward, but now you've gone through the publishing process. Were there some new things that you learned? Constraints and things that were maybe very easy to do with the publishing process of your book specifically?

[00:03:40] I think probably one of the things that was easiest to, or one of the things that I knew ahead of time, I knew I needed to ask, what are the submission criteria? What is that process? I think in conversations when I did on the bookstore and, you know, from teaching and various other places. That's one piece that people don't think about or think to ask about. So I kind of had that heads up. I knew I needed to ask.

[00:04:08] I needed to look at different publishing companies and what were their submission guidelines and did they have open submission periods. So that I had a heads up on that one. So talk to us a little bit about the title, Tattoos, Tacos and Time. What's the story of that? How does it capture the spirit of the collection? Yeah. At a certain point in my life, I became a tattoo collector.

[00:04:36] And I had always wanted to be a tattoo collector. And so then at a certain point in my life when I was doing some self searching and discovery, and I had already been writing some of these poems that are in this book, I started getting tattoos. And so they started to represent different parts of that journey and that process. I love tacos. No, there is a bigger connection than that.

[00:05:02] But, and I found myself in meaningful conversations over tacos and over cheese dip and fajitas and things like that. And those conversations, you actually, there's one poem in the book called Memory Lane that talks a little bit about that. And the collection also looks at love and loss and grief and healing and that self journey.

[00:05:31] And we always need more time for that. And so there is a haiku in the collection with the same title, Tattoos, Tacos and Time. And it captures that. There's always room for one more tattoo. Always a desire for one more taco and one more conversation over cheese dip. And always, always, always a desire for more time. And so that kind of pulled everything together. Yeah. I like that. I have, once I got my first tattoo, I was hooked. Oh yeah. I like that.

[00:06:01] I like that. I found, one of the things I enjoyed when I started to read your collection was, it's a transformative journey. And I mean, I felt in the beginning, oh, she's finding love. Oh, this is wonderful. Oh, her heart broke. Oh my gosh, let me beat this person up. I mean, and then of course, you know, the resilience at the end. I mean, it's, it's our journeys, all of us, you know, if we've been fortunate to

[00:06:28] have been enough to fall in love and have our little hearts broken. Um, it's, it's universal. Mm-hmm. So it, to me, that journey that you went through, you brought me through it too. So thank you. Yeah. Thank you. It's interesting to the little section at the end, and I say little because it's probably, it has the fewest number of poems in that third section, um, that really focus on specifically that self-discovery. Those, some of those were written well before any of the others. Mm-hmm.

[00:06:58] And so that self-discovery and coming home to myself part of the journey was actually happening before, during, and after all of that other love and heartbreak and loss and things too. So. What's your process like? Do you write every day? I mean, how, is it inspirational? How does that come to you? So, it, a little bit of everything. Um, I try to find poetry everywhere. Um, poetry finds me everywhere.

[00:07:26] Um, I was actually writing lines in my notes app at a red light on the drive here. Really? Yes. Um, and a lot of times that's what I will start with. Um, you know, a couple lines on a scrap piece of paper or a couple lines in my notes app, something that feels like it's got a, a, a lyrical rhythm to it or something that's really on my heart or something that I've seen out wherever. And it, you know, spoke to me and then I'll go back to it.

[00:07:55] Um, occasionally I, something will hit me an experience that I'm having or a memory or an emotion, um, that I am able to unpack all at one time in the notes app or on the paper. Um, and then it's just a matter of like going back later and dusting it off and tweaking a little bit. But a lot of times it's more of the couple of lines here, a thought here, or, you know, right using this line at some point in time.

[00:08:22] And then I'll go back, um, later and give myself intentional time. I also like to use prompt challenges. And so in October there is, um, it's called Inktober and it's a challenge for visual artists who like to ink and draw. And I thought, well, what would, that would be kind of cool to like try to write a poem every day using the same prompts that the visual artists are using to draw.

[00:08:48] And so I started that several years ago when I would maybe get like two or three days in and it was really hard to write a poem every day of October. Um, and then I was teaching ninth grade English for a period and I was teaching them about poetry and I was like, I need to branch out because I'm teaching them about haiku and I'm teaching them about acrostic and I don't write them that much or that often. Usually what I had been doing was free verse.

[00:09:10] And so I started challenging myself and then it became really more than just a challenge. It was, um, inspiring might be a little bit strong, but it was a pull to use these prompts and these different, um, poetry styles and still make it relevant, not just some random, um, poem about nothing. It was relevant to things that I had experienced. So that's my process.

[00:09:37] It's a little messy and chaotic, but, um, a little bit everything. Yeah. And it works. Yeah. And I guess the form is the vehicle to get those kinds of thoughts out that you might take something and change it. That's the way you do in class, right? Yeah. I was just going to say that, um, I, so I teach a, uh, a class what like twice a year for Red Hawk. It's creative writing, just basic creative writing, kind of all levels, um, and all types.

[00:10:06] And, um, I find as I'm teaching that I end up exploring more along with my students because of, well, I'm, I'm creating these challenges for other people. Um, so like, well, why am I not challenging myself along with them? Um, and it's, it is easy to get into these, these ruts of just doing the same kind of thing over and over again.

[00:10:29] Um, but I have found as well, like you were just saying Angela, that the constraints of, uh, a haiku or a 14 line sonnet, um, challenge the writer to say something in a way that they normally wouldn't say. And you end up finding more depth in that particular poem because of those constraints. Especially with a haiku and you've got a number of syllables, but you still need to say it

[00:10:59] the same thing because that idea or that topic, it, it fits. It has to be this. And so now I'm, now I'm trying to be more intentional about how I say it. Right. Um, the words that I use and still get that feeling and that mood and all of those things in the poem that you wanted to, to begin with. Yeah. Yeah. Well that, um, that makes me think of, so I, I wrote a blurb for the back of your book

[00:11:27] and, um, something that really struck me from reading your book is how it, uh, demonstrates, um, this need to write poetry. Um, so I was just wondering if you could speak a little bit to that, uh, just like how, how does poetry, how does writing poetry, um, even stopping in, uh, the side of the road, uh, or at a, uh, stoplight or something like I need to write this.

[00:11:57] How, how does poetry help us communicate something that ordinary language, ordinary conversation doesn't? I think that poetry allows us to break the rules in a way that maybe journaling or other types of writing feel like we can't break the rules are a little bit more rigid. So, um, you know, I think poetry gives us that freedom.

[00:12:25] Um, poetry has helped me process and understand things because I'm having to think about them differently to put them on the page in a poetic form of some kind, whether it's free verse or haiku or whatever. Um, I'm having to think about them differently. And I think that thinking about it differently to be able to write it as poetry is part of the

[00:12:53] draw because, um, it takes me out of everyday thinking or mundane thinking it. And, and really like sometimes, um, even if it's just a couple of lines or an idea that I'm writing down, but I know that it's going to feed this poem later that can lift my spirits. Um, if I'm, you know, having a bad day, um, just, and so there's, there's this draw to write

[00:13:19] and create poetry because it makes me a better person because I'm, I'm processing things and doing things for myself. I'm not sure that that, maybe that answers the question. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I'll tell you what I'd like to do is hear you read a poem. Yes. Um, cause we're talking about all of the poems and how you're, how you've written in your style. Um, is there a particular poem you'd like to read for us now? Uh, sure. That'd be great.

[00:13:45] I love, if people could see this and I'll have to take a photo of all the colored tabs in your book. The colored tabs. Fabulous. Um, and I have my little key at the front. Purple tabs are little poems. Pink are a little spicy. Blue tabs are sad. Yellow focus on me and self-development. Um, orange are a little snarky or salty. Oh my God, that's fabulous. Categories. So which color will you be reading? Um, if I can find it. I did for like a hot minute in mine and then I forgot.

[00:14:18] Okay. So, it is purple. So, it is, um, a love poem. This is the poem that I was going to ask you to read. Oh, yay! Awesome. Awesome. Well, I was gonna put my glasses on but I think I can see. Okay. Um, this one is called Jealous. I spoke to the stars about her as they twinkled over Brown Mountain and they told me they're jealous of her eyes and the way they sparkle.

[00:14:46] I spoke to the wind about her as it blew through the trees on the mountain trails and it whispered solemnly that it envies how gentle her touch is and in contrast how strong her will is. I spoke to the sunlight about her as it made its way across the sky to settle in the evening here in the west and it confessed that it longed to shine as brightly as her smile when it lights up a room.

[00:15:10] I spoke to the ocean about her and in each rhythmic wave lapping against the shore it confided it is jealous of the depths of her empathy. I spoke to the songbirds about her and in between their morning melodies and evening serenades they told me they are jealous of the way her laugh is a song unmatched. I spoke to the winding river about her and as it made its way along its course over mountain rock beds and through the shaded woods nurturing plants and creatures all.

[00:15:38] It shared with me it's jealous of her and the endless way she takes care of those she loves. I spoke to the mountains about her and as they stood stalwart along the blue ridge they told me of their jealousy for her strength the way she holds up so many. I spoke to the universe about her and she was not surprised to hear that I found her in everything I saw and that everywhere I mentioned her I found my audience in awe. She is a woman after all. Oh love it.

[00:16:08] Thank you. That's got some interesting elements to it. I mean you're talking about the specific and the universal kind of all in the same poem. Is that by design or does that just happen? Does the muse bring that to you? This was by design so the idea the muse brought the idea I mean you know like it is inspired by someone and the sparkle of the eyes and the gentle touch and the empathy and the strength are

[00:16:36] actual characteristics of this person. But I wanted it to be something bigger because you meet people and their energy just takes up the space in a good way and I wanted the poem to represent that. That it was bigger than kind of the normal or the natural but while also being true to the muse. Very good. Excellent. Excellent work.

[00:17:05] How long did it take you to write that? I would have to consult my notes app because sometimes I'll mark when I started and when I finished. This was one that I probably word vomited into my notes app originally with sort of a skeleton outline of the things I wanted to note, the things I wanted to talk about and then went back and hung the clothes on it.

[00:17:31] You know and put the additional so because originally one of the draft versions didn't mention Brown Mountain or the Blue Ridge. And then as I you know kind of read back through it and I wanted it to also you know connect to Western North Carolina because that has inspired me. You know living out here has inspired some of what I write. So it was a little bit of a process as well as that kind of initial vomit.

[00:17:57] It's very well structured and you know it goes from small to huge to you know universal. So I mean it's like you can tell there had to have been some thought and a good amount of rewrites to get it to exactly where you wanted it to be. Which is an interesting journey for me because in all of the other writing I've done, my dissertation for my PhD, other papers anywhere, I'm never really a fan of rough drafts. Don't tell my students I said that. I mean I've just never, it didn't feel right.

[00:18:26] But in writing poetry it's something that I've learned because you know you do, you want to make something universal in nature while also being specific to whatever muse or idea you're writing. And for the most part that requires drafting and redrafting and looking back over it. And so I've come to appreciate that drafting process. Get the initial word vomit out on the page.

[00:18:54] Give yourself some time or space and then go back to it and then go back to it if you need to. So that's been an interesting process for me. Something that I recall thinking about as I worked through your poems is, and what works so well for your book, is that your poetry is descriptive rather than prescriptive.

[00:19:14] So they open up space for your readers to experience the emotions that you are conveying. But you're not telling us to feel a particular way. Rather, you are inviting us to feel along with the speaker those particular emotions. So I was just, let's see. Thank you for that, actually.

[00:19:43] That was an unintended goal, or not unintended, but I appreciate that that's how it was read. So thank you. Yeah. So just connected to that, I was wondering, what did you, as you were putting the book together, the poems together, what feeling or thought did you hope stays with your readers the longest?

[00:20:09] I think that sense that was brought up of feelings and experiences being universal. These are, you know, we've almost all loved. We've almost all lost love or changed love or, you know, had some sort of unexpected thing in love. We've all lost. We've all experienced grief. And it doesn't have to be just romantic love, you know, friendship love and the love of family.

[00:20:38] We've experienced all of these things. And we're all growing, whether we pay attention to it or not. We are all, you know, on a growth journey and a discovery journey ourselves. And so when I was putting them together, I wanted readers to be able to say, ah, I'm not alone. And it's like the idea, you know, you think you're alone until you read and then you realize that you're not so alone in the world because there are other people out there who've experienced these things.

[00:21:04] And I very much wanted to put that into the order of the poems and which ones, because not everything that I've written is in here, obviously. And be intentional about that and that we can grow.

[00:21:25] Like even though some of the self-discovery poems were written at different chronological times from the other poems that are in here, putting them in the back kind of sets that tone for through love, through loss, we still have self and we can still keep growing. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, I think, the beauty of sharing poetry. You know, it's one thing to write poetry for yourself and, you know, just process all of those feelings.

[00:21:54] But when you make them public, like go to a reading at Tasteful Beans, who is our sponsor. Nice plug. Well done there. You must have done this before. No, actually I thought. Well, good instincts on that. Tasteful Beans Coffee House in downtown Hickory, owned by Scott Owens. Poet laureate of the city of Hickory.

[00:22:24] I have been to quite a few readings there, but readings anywhere where one of the audience members will approach a reader and say, you know, that poem that you read made me cry or just touched me in some way. And the writer just, you know, wrote the poem and here it is.

[00:22:51] They've read it maybe 20 times out loud and it was just in the right spot at the right time. So you just never know when your poetry is going to reach the right person. I think that's the beautiful thing about poetry and art in general. There's one meaning behind what the artist creates. And every single time a reader or someone in a gallery goes to look at the painting or whatever the case might be,

[00:23:20] every time someone interacts with that art, there's an added layer of experience and meaning to it. And I think that's what makes art beautiful. I'm just kind of curious, and since Nari is a published author as well, award winning, I thought what I would ask you both is, have you ever heard other people read your poems out loud at a reading maybe? No.

[00:23:42] Maeve Fox, she read, she recorded one of my poems and posted it on her YouTube channel, I think. And it was, she put it on Facebook. So that's, I think, about one of the only times I've really heard someone else read it. It was so interesting to just get that slightly different interpretation. Yeah. I could imagine it would be like a singer-songwriter who lets someone else sing their song. Doing a cover version, yeah.

[00:24:12] Yeah. And bring something different to it. Absolutely. Yeah. So that day will come for you, and it'll be interesting to see your reaction to it. How did you know your collection was complete at this point? Because one of the problems we have is writers who won't put down the pen. And so you've got to know that, okay, this is done. I'm moving on to the next collection, which it sounds like you're doing as you drove here. How did you know? Wow. That's a big question. How did I know?

[00:24:42] At the chance, or at the probably sounding cliche, like I just, I knew. Like, it just felt right that this set of poems were meant to be together. And things were shifting in my own life and the things that I was writing about. And so as, like, the content of what I was writing shifted,

[00:25:08] it felt like it was moving in a direction that was different than what's here. And so then these were sort of done, if that makes sense. I mean, in a strange way you categorized whether you want to call it that or not, but subliminally you had some unique three parts. Yeah. And you knew that these parts were done, and you were starting to write another part.

[00:25:31] Yeah, and it's actually been wild because once I got the yes from Red Hawk that these were going to be published, it was this freeing feeling to continue to write the other things that I had started to dabble in because I knew that these were done, and these were settled, and they were in their place, and it gave me this additional freedom to write in this other direction.

[00:26:00] And still more similar themes, but just different poems from a different time in life. And so, yeah, it was a little freeing to know that these were in their place. The other thing I want to point out is that it's a pretty book. Yes. Just for anyone out there, I know you can't see it, but trust me, there are drawings throughout it, and your layout is a little more unique. We sometimes use different layout artists, and you've got a very creative individual, Amber.

[00:26:29] I forget Amber's last name. Zizek. Zizek. Amber did a wonderful job of laying it out, and it's a distinct, unique look that's attractive. What was that process like for you, working with someone who was equally creative because she also made, like I said, the little line drawings are spectacular. And you'll just have to buy a copy of the book to see how great it is. What you're talking about. No, that was, it was such a fun process because I met with Amber,

[00:26:59] and I was telling her about the story of the poems and the journey and the why. And then I shared with her, you know, a copy of them, and she was, had read through them, and then we met again, and then she was like, and it feels like this, and I see this, and it was like somebody reading my mind and turning all of my words into exactly the visual representations

[00:27:28] that, because I am not a visual artist. I cannot draw a stick figure. So it was nice to have somebody read what I had written and see the things that I was wanting to be seen. And then, yeah, then she took it away. And I did get to have a couple of, you know, some of my ideas were a little bit more straightforward. Like there's a poem called Onion. I was like, I really want a sliced onion, you know, illustration for that one.

[00:27:57] And so, you know, that one was pretty easy, pretty straightforward. Anybody can handle, like, that idea of a visual. But then the rest of them, like some of the ones that she, well, I mean all of them that she put, and where she put them were just, it just felt right. Don't you love that collaboration? When you get in sync and somebody understands you and you them. We must have been an interesting pair at the coffee shop, like getting excited about the words and then the visuals

[00:28:27] and kind of playing off each other in that conversation. Because I think you probably could have seen the excited energy field around us. That's so cool. So I was very glad to be able to work with her. Would you give us one more reading? Yeah. Sure. Because you're getting us all excited about the book now. I want to hear more. I'll read this one.

[00:28:50] But this is an example of one that I wrote years ago in response to one of those Inktober prompts. The prompt was fan. So this is what I wrote. It's hot. Sweat dripping into my eyes. Clothes clinging to my skin. The ice in the lemonade doesn't stand a chance. Kind of hot. She sits on the porch swing sideways. Legs stretch long in front of her.

[00:29:18] Attempting to cool herself with a fan she found at the antique store. Eyes closed and head tossed back. The way her neck exists, exposed, and then dips to find her shoulder. I find the porch ceiling fan is insufficient for cooling me off. And it's not just the summer heat I'm fighting. I like that. Yes. We've all had fans before. Well, I'll tell you what.

[00:29:48] This has been an amazing 40 minutes or so with you, Angela. I'd like to know, do you have any readings coming up? I will be participating in the Burke Arts Council first Friday night poetry reading that they do monthly now, June 5th at 630. One of the Red Hawk family, Kara Freeman, she is coordinating that with the Burke Arts Council.

[00:30:17] So I'll be reading there. I'm off to Savannah and then Richmond. I'll be in Charlotte for a couple of different events. Not necessarily readings. But no, I'm open. My schedule is wide open for anybody that wants to book a reading. Great. Is there a particular way to find out where you're reading? Instagram or something? Yeah, so I am on Instagram and TikTok. And I have a website, AngelaWrites.Studio. And I keep the calendar updated there.

[00:30:46] But yeah, Instagram, TikTok. At ThatTattooedProfessor is my handle on Instagram and TikTok. And the Burke event is going to be at the Arts Council? It's the Burke Arts Council, yep. Okay, okay. Just wanted to make sure. And it's actually an open mic for anybody that wants to read. Well, thank you so much for joining us today. It sounds like there's a second collection on the way.

[00:31:12] There are poems in the works, a title already picked. And so we'll see what happens. Are you going to reveal that now or do we have to wait? It would be called Unfinished Business. Oh, nice. Yeah, okay. I like that. That's open-ended enough to make the next chapter exhilarating in its own way. Yeah. Okay, great. Well, Angela, thank you for joining us today. We only have one last chore for you. Okay.

[00:31:39] The name of the podcast is... I can't even do it myself. The name of the podcast is Red Pub Pod. A little tricky. Can you say it? Red Pub Pod. Oh, wow. Naria, what do you think? Should I try? If you want. I've been practicing it all. Right, same. If I listen to it. In front of the mirror and everything, so you get the right inflection. Okay. Let her fly. Red Pub Pod. That's great.

[00:32:08] Oh, Red Pub Pod. I think the fact that we have more than 12 listeners is helping people realize they better know the name of this pod. If you come on the show, you've got to stand to deliver. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for joining us, and we welcome you to the Red Hog Publications family, and we'll see you back on another podcast when Unfinished Business hits the stands. Thank you. Bye. Bye. This is... Red Pub Pod.

[00:32:37] Oh, Red Pub Pod. Red Pub Pod. A podcast from Red Hog Publications. I've been practicing it all. Rising. You've been listening to The Mesh, an online media network of shows and programs ranging from business to arts, sports to entertainment, music to community. All programs are available on the website as well as through iTunes and YouTube.

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