Gladiator II

[00:00:02] What you want, when you want it, where you want it.

[00:00:06] This is The MESH.

[00:00:10] Footcandle Films. Film news and reviews from two guys who really like movies.

[00:00:17] This episode is brought to you by the Footcandle Film Society.

[00:00:21] For a schedule of upcoming screenings and membership information, visit the Society's website at www.footcandle.org.

[00:00:35] Hello, everyone, and welcome to Footcandle Films here on the MESH.TV Podcast Network.

[00:00:41] My name is Alan Jackson. With me, Chris Fry, both of us with the Footcandle Film Society and the annual Footcandle Film Festival.

[00:00:49] Chris, happy Wicked Week to you.

[00:00:53] Why, thank you, Alan.

[00:00:54] Only the most hyped...

[00:00:55] Happy Wicked Week to you as well.

[00:00:57] Thank you. Only the most hyped film and marketed film I think I've seen in years.

[00:01:00] You know, that is the one thing that I don't think has been done is they haven't...

[00:01:05] You know, Joe Biden has not officially deemed this Wicked Week for the entire country.

[00:01:10] Right.

[00:01:10] Outside of that, I think that may be the one marketing thing that has not been done.

[00:01:13] That is one opportunity that's been missed.

[00:01:15] Right.

[00:01:15] No, it's just a...

[00:01:17] I joke, but not really, because it does feel like that's the film that's everywhere right now.

[00:01:24] Agreed.

[00:01:24] It's got the toy lines.

[00:01:25] It's got the cross-promotion.

[00:01:27] It's got the AMC introductions at every movie you go to now.

[00:01:30] I mean, it's just...

[00:01:31] It's a lot.

[00:01:33] It is a lot.

[00:01:34] We are planning on reviewing it this weekend, right?

[00:01:37] We're watching it this weekend.

[00:01:38] Yeah, we're watching it this weekend.

[00:01:39] Reviewing it.

[00:01:40] That'll be our review for next week.

[00:01:41] And next week's episode.

[00:01:42] That's our plan.

[00:01:42] That is, yeah.

[00:01:43] If all goes well, if I can get tickets, I mean, I assume it's going to be sold and maybe

[00:01:49] not sold out, but probably close in some places.

[00:01:52] Could be.

[00:01:53] We'll see.

[00:01:53] We'll see.

[00:01:54] Our plan is next week we will be discussing Wicked.

[00:01:57] We will not be discussing Wicked anymore today after that little setup I did.

[00:02:02] Fair enough.

[00:02:03] Instead, we're going to be focusing our attention on the other big release coming out this weekend.

[00:02:06] Yes, Chris.

[00:02:07] I can't help it.

[00:02:08] Yeah.

[00:02:09] Let's say one more thing about Wicked.

[00:02:11] As a public service announcement, you and I saw a critic screening of the movie that we're

[00:02:17] going to discuss today, Gladiator 2.

[00:02:20] But on our car ride to the critic screening, you and I were discussing Wicked because it's

[00:02:25] just drilling our heads.

[00:02:26] And you reminded me that it is a part one of two parts.

[00:02:32] That's correct.

[00:02:32] So as a public service to our listeners, I want everyone to be aware they haven't really

[00:02:37] mentioned that in the marketing.

[00:02:39] So we didn't want everybody to have a Dune moment where they go in and they expect to

[00:02:42] see a self-contained movie because this was a self-contained play when it was a musical

[00:02:47] and you didn't have to come back two nights.

[00:02:50] Nope.

[00:02:50] It was done.

[00:02:51] You know, it was not one shot.

[00:02:53] So apparently this is a part one of part two.

[00:02:55] So we don't want anybody to be surprised and end up choking on your popcorn when the

[00:03:00] end credits roll.

[00:03:01] Good call.

[00:03:01] I think that's the least we can do for our audience is give them that heads up.

[00:03:05] So it is a part one film and there will be a part two in about a year or so afterwards.

[00:03:09] So we will see how that plays with the movie going audiences this weekend.

[00:03:14] All right, Chris, let's turn our attention to the other big release that's coming out

[00:03:18] this weekend and we had a chance to see it and we're going to be reviewing it for you.

[00:03:23] It is Gladiator II or Gladiator 2.

[00:03:27] That is the latest film from director Ridley Scott.

[00:03:30] Obviously, it is a sequel to the blockbuster film Gladiator, which came out in 2000, I believe.

[00:03:38] Kind of put Russell Crowe on the map as a leading actor and won a Best Picture award along with

[00:03:46] several other acclaims at the time.

[00:03:49] It's a big hit.

[00:03:50] And here we are 24 years later and we've got the sequel, Gladiator II.

[00:03:55] So Chris and I will be reviewing that here in a moment for you.

[00:03:58] And then after that review, we do have some movie news and trailers to talk about for some

[00:04:03] upcoming movies that we're going to dissect and expound on.

[00:04:08] Followed by, I do want to talk a little bit about some early Oscar predictions, Chris.

[00:04:14] So different publications, different groups have been putting out some of their predictions

[00:04:20] for what they think are going to be the pool of Best Picture nominees.

[00:04:23] We're just going to hit that Best Picture nominee category today.

[00:04:27] We may cover some other categories in future episodes as we're kind of leaning into, waiting

[00:04:32] to hear when the announcements are going to be in the first of the year of the nominations.

[00:04:37] But, you know, we're far enough along in the year.

[00:04:38] I think we can kind of look retrospectively and say, where do we think we are as far as

[00:04:42] the Best Picture nominees for this year?

[00:04:45] Or what do we think that might hold up?

[00:04:47] So we'll go into that towards the end of the episode.

[00:04:50] But without further ado, let's go ahead and sound the trumpets.

[00:04:54] Let's release the CGI animated animals that we have to fight on the Coliseum floor as we

[00:05:01] get into our review of Gladiator 2.

[00:05:03] Let's go back to the arena.

[00:05:05] Oh, that was nice.

[00:05:06] Coliseum.

[00:05:07] Coliseum, yeah.

[00:05:09] Strength to none.

[00:05:17] It is an art choosing gladiators.

[00:05:22] They're usually prisoners of war.

[00:05:26] I claim this city for the glory of Rome.

[00:05:32] You have something.

[00:05:34] You rage.

[00:05:37] Never let it go.

[00:05:39] It will carry you.

[00:05:44] With Gladiator 2, our summary given to us by IMDb is as follows.

[00:05:51] After his home is conquered by the tyrannical emperors who now lead Rome, Lucius is forced

[00:05:57] to enter the Coliseum and must look to his past to find strength to return the glory of

[00:06:02] Rome to its people.

[00:06:04] Lucius in this film is played by Mr. Paul Mescal, which has been, you know, kind of a big selling

[00:06:11] point of the film, him coming off after Sun and what was the other film that he was in?

[00:06:17] But the name just slipped my mind.

[00:06:20] All of us strangers?

[00:06:21] All of us strangers, yeah.

[00:06:22] All of us strangers, yeah.

[00:06:22] So those two films kind of got him a lot of buzz, but this is like a big, obviously,

[00:06:27] a big film for him to land.

[00:06:28] A little bigger budget than the other two films that he's been in.

[00:06:31] Tiny bit.

[00:06:31] So Paul Mescal is the central gladiator of this film because Russell Crowe, yes, he died

[00:06:38] at the end of the first one.

[00:06:39] Spoiler.

[00:06:39] Spoiler.

[00:06:40] So sorry, if you haven't seen it from 24 years ago.

[00:06:43] A 24-year-old movie, yeah.

[00:06:45] But in this film, New, we have Denzel Washington playing a role that he is kind of taking over

[00:06:53] the Oliver Reed role a little bit from the first film.

[00:06:55] I mean, not the same character, but his name is Macronus?

[00:06:59] Macronus.

[00:06:59] Macronus, yeah.

[00:07:00] It's like Maximus, Macronus, a lot of different, you know, crazy names, but he's playing Macronus.

[00:07:04] Then we have Connie Nielsen reprising her role as Lucilla.

[00:07:08] Oh, and the other new person I forgot to mention, Pedro Pascal, Marcus Acacius.

[00:07:13] Yes.

[00:07:13] So, yes.

[00:07:15] So some new people, some returning people.

[00:07:19] Alan, this is going to be a unique review in that we're going to jump right into, I think,

[00:07:25] the most crucial question.

[00:07:26] This film is an action adventure film.

[00:07:31] So instead of, you know, normally we kind of have these big setups, but I'm just going

[00:07:36] to break it down to something you alluded to in the intro that you gave to the episode.

[00:07:41] Baboons, monkeys, rhinos, or I think they're baboons.

[00:07:45] So baboons, rhinos, or sharks.

[00:07:48] What's your ranking of these three Coliseum action scenes?

[00:07:52] Okay, good, good.

[00:07:52] I like this.

[00:07:53] Because that's a crew, I mean, that's what these films are known for, Coliseum battles.

[00:07:58] So the baboons, the rhinos, or the sharks.

[00:08:02] What was, and you did allude, yes, CGI is being used.

[00:08:05] There were not live sharks in the water.

[00:08:08] So of those three, I think performed the best in the film.

[00:08:16] I personally think the sharks were more effective in terms of, because I liked that battle scene,

[00:08:23] because it was just interesting.

[00:08:24] It was, they flooded the Coliseum floor with water and they kind of reenacted a ship battle

[00:08:30] between two sides and they had sharks swimming in the floor.

[00:08:33] I liked that.

[00:08:34] I thought that was pretty good.

[00:08:35] Then I'll go rhino.

[00:08:36] Okay.

[00:08:37] I'll go rhino next, because I thought the rhinos did, were at least interesting looking,

[00:08:41] kind of a unique animal to see on the Coliseum floor.

[00:08:45] I got to give the baboons, the wild monkeys, the bottom rung.

[00:08:48] They did not work for me at all.

[00:08:50] So I think that at that point in the film, that was about 20 minutes into the film, we get the...

[00:08:56] So that is one of the first...

[00:08:58] Yeah, that's where I started to worry about this film.

[00:09:02] Okay.

[00:09:03] Because yeah, that whole bit did not work for me.

[00:09:06] Okay.

[00:09:07] So...

[00:09:07] But it sounds like if that was 20 minutes in and these other battle scenes were later,

[00:09:12] maybe you did warm up to the film.

[00:09:14] I think you're onto something there.

[00:09:15] I think as the CGI animals got better for me, the film thus also got better along the way.

[00:09:23] Now, I hadn't thought about it that way, but thanks for letting me frame it that way.

[00:09:27] So...

[00:09:28] This is a film that I do feel like has a lot of issues, has a lot of flaws.

[00:09:35] Sure.

[00:09:36] At the end of the day, it manages to cobble together something that I think is at least entertaining

[00:09:44] and at least has something unique going for it by the end.

[00:09:49] Although I'll tell you the first half to two thirds of this movie, I did not think we were going to get there.

[00:09:53] This is a movie that is slovenly dedicated to the memory of its predecessor.

[00:09:59] Yeah.

[00:10:00] To an extreme fault.

[00:10:01] To the point where, look, I love sequels.

[00:10:05] I think sequels, when done well, are fun.

[00:10:07] Because, hey, we get to revisit characters that we've already met.

[00:10:11] We don't have to do all the setup with everybody as much.

[00:10:13] We get to just follow along and see what their next adventures or escapades are.

[00:10:17] And we can kind of expand on them.

[00:10:20] You can do some more character development with these characters.

[00:10:22] Sequels are great when done right.

[00:10:24] When they're just done as a, hey, let's just cash in on what worked this first time.

[00:10:29] Let's just do it again with different people in the roles and just tweak a few minor things.

[00:10:33] But otherwise, people want to see this.

[00:10:35] That's where sequels don't work or I think get a lot of critical derision out there from this.

[00:10:42] This movie is a movie of two halves for me.

[00:10:44] And that first half is exactly what I just described.

[00:10:47] It is, hey, let's just do Gladiator 1 again with a different actor.

[00:10:52] We're going to tweak just a couple minor things.

[00:10:54] But otherwise, it's still basically the same story.

[00:10:56] And we're going to have as many callbacks to the first movie as we possibly humanly can.

[00:11:02] And so this first half of the movie, I was really bored, tired, kind of frustrated.

[00:11:09] Okay.

[00:11:09] It's like, no, please don't do this for the whole movie.

[00:11:13] Luckily for the film, about halfway and maybe, you know, on the latter half of the film, they start to realize that there's a slightly different story they could tell.

[00:11:24] A slightly different situation, a slightly different direction they could start to go in.

[00:11:29] And I really admired it for that latter half of the film, trying to be different and trying to be something unique.

[00:11:36] And yes, it was still worshiping on Maximus, you know, the character from the first Gladiator.

[00:11:42] It was so much even in the second half.

[00:11:44] But at least in the second half, they made a rhyme or reason for it.

[00:11:48] So it is a tale of two films for me.

[00:11:52] Overall, I'm going to come out generally slightly positive on this film.

[00:11:57] Okay.

[00:11:57] I do think it was overall is definitely a lesser step down from the first Gladiator.

[00:12:03] There's no doubt about that in my mind.

[00:12:07] Yeah, I'm still going, Chris.

[00:12:09] I'm sorry.

[00:12:09] I'll kick it over to you here in a second.

[00:12:11] You're fine.

[00:12:11] The one other main thing I think that hurt this film or kept it from being anywhere close to the level of the first film is I struggled to find where this film had any real emotion or heart.

[00:12:26] I guess, you know, it was kind of said in our discussions after the film last night.

[00:12:30] It was just missing that.

[00:12:32] And you mentioned how the first Gladiator, you know, everybody loves it because of the battles and the fights.

[00:12:37] I do love that movie.

[00:12:38] I don't love it because of the battles and the fights.

[00:12:40] I love it because I really generally like the story.

[00:12:44] It's a simple story, but I like that story in the first one.

[00:12:48] And I feel like there's true emotion in that story where when there are moments and beats where we're supposed to feel for certain characters, I totally felt it in the first movie.

[00:12:58] Did not feel it in this movie at all.

[00:13:00] So that's, this is a spectacle movie.

[00:13:03] This is a movie that knows what it's trying to do.

[00:13:05] And it does have some great spectacle elements to it.

[00:13:09] And it is an epic film that Ridley Scott's put together, but it is missing.

[00:13:14] It's missing its beating heart, which is what I think made Gladiator one for me special.

[00:13:21] And I just kept looking for it in this film.

[00:13:23] I never found it.

[00:13:24] And they want you to have, they want to have it.

[00:13:27] They're like leading you into scenes where like, no, we want the audience to be like caught up in this moment.

[00:13:32] And it just doesn't click for whatever reason, either because they don't commit to it enough or they don't have the right people saying the right words and the lines to make these things.

[00:13:41] I don't know what didn't make this happen, but I just walked out feeling very, very distant from the film, a little colder to the film.

[00:13:49] And that's not what this film could have been.

[00:13:52] So that's where I am with the film.

[00:13:55] Generally slightly on the positive side, but still, this is nowhere near the first one.

[00:14:01] So Chris, I'll turn over to you.

[00:14:03] I'm sorry.

[00:14:03] I took over for too long there.

[00:14:05] No, no, you're fine.

[00:14:07] So you use the word escapade.

[00:14:09] And now I've been able to think about is the Janet Jackson song Escapade, which is one of my favorite songs of hers.

[00:14:14] Actually, I'm a huge fan of it, but I love the song Escapade that she does.

[00:14:17] So now I'm going to try to block that out of my head.

[00:14:19] Look, I was a huge Janet Jackson fan in the day.

[00:14:24] That was a track 10, I believe, on the Rhythm Nation 1814 album.

[00:14:28] Yeah, good album.

[00:14:29] Okay, so returning to Gladiator 2, I think you and I, we talked in the car ride back last night.

[00:14:37] And we're basically on the same page.

[00:14:40] And I had the feeling of – so the baboon, which the baboon battle does happen within the first 20 minutes, like you said.

[00:14:49] I was a little anxious from the get-go because with the opening credits sequence, which does kind of do a recap of the first film just with like this animation style.

[00:15:01] And you kind of like, oh, here are the big plot points of the first film.

[00:15:04] And I was kind of fine with that.

[00:15:06] It's like opening titles or anything.

[00:15:07] Sure, whatever.

[00:15:08] I was fine with that.

[00:15:10] But the first time we see Paul Meskel, he's with his wife.

[00:15:15] And I was like, okay, spoiler alert.

[00:15:18] But it's not a spoiler alert because we know in the first film, Russell Crowe, they have this kind of bookends with like there's family.

[00:15:24] It's important.

[00:15:25] He was taken away from his family.

[00:15:26] Wife dies.

[00:15:27] So in this, you see Paul Meskel with his wife.

[00:15:30] And they're like – they see battles off in the distance.

[00:15:33] And so they start arming themselves.

[00:15:34] And I'm like, okay, well, she's toast.

[00:15:37] Yeah.

[00:15:37] And I don't think that – I think everyone in the theater last night and everybody watching – I think you'll probably kind of get that too.

[00:15:44] And it kind of set the tone for like, yeah, we are going to basically hit a lot of the same beats that the first film felt.

[00:15:50] And sure enough, they have a battle scene.

[00:15:53] Not in a Colosseum, but it's kind of a siege.

[00:15:55] Rome is taking over this.

[00:15:56] Well, keep in mind, yeah, the first Gladiator, the whole opening sequence is it's Maximus kind of as a general in the army.

[00:16:03] And they're fighting off – I forget which other group they are.

[00:16:06] But it's out kind of in a forest field area.

[00:16:08] Right.

[00:16:09] And it is a big spectacle battle scene, but it's meant to showcase this is who Maximus is.

[00:16:14] This is why the people around him respect him.

[00:16:16] And this is the relationship he has with the king or the emperor at the time.

[00:16:21] Yeah.

[00:16:21] So they're trying to do that same thing in this opening.

[00:16:24] It's like beat for beat.

[00:16:26] It's like, okay, we want you to know who this guy is.

[00:16:29] And we're going to show you fighting in this battle.

[00:16:31] And we're supposed to get a sense of what people think of him by this.

[00:16:34] And anyway, yeah.

[00:16:35] And it's – I mean, granted, I guess, like you said, they try to do it a little differently in that he's fighting against Rome instead of fighting for Rome.

[00:16:43] True.

[00:16:44] But still, you're kind of like –

[00:16:45] Yeah.

[00:16:46] You know where this is all kind of leading.

[00:16:47] And then, you know, wife passes away and he kind of takes a reminder of her passing away with him on his like, you know –

[00:16:55] Just like what was done in the first movie.

[00:16:57] Yeah.

[00:16:57] So it just – that was bothersome.

[00:16:59] Now, I alluded to earlier that Denzel Washington takes on Macroness who kind of is semi like the Oliver Reed character in the first film.

[00:17:11] And that his – Denzel Washington was a high point of the film for me.

[00:17:17] Yes.

[00:17:17] Every time he was on screen, I think one of the first times we see him, he's kind of anticipating these gladiators and he's like twiddling his fingers.

[00:17:26] He just – he seems to just be really enjoying getting to play the role that he's playing.

[00:17:33] Absolutely.

[00:17:34] I think – yes, I completely echo.

[00:17:36] I mean, I think all the acting in here is good.

[00:17:39] Right.

[00:17:39] We can talk about Paul Meskel in a little bit because I think there's some problems there.

[00:17:44] It's not Paul Meskel's fault.

[00:17:45] It's problems in the casting.

[00:17:47] It's interesting, I think.

[00:17:48] But Denzel Washington as Macroness, he may be the reason to see this movie.

[00:17:54] Honestly.

[00:17:55] I could honestly say that.

[00:17:57] I think, yes, if you're a fan of the first gladiator, you'll want to see this just because it is a lot more of the same.

[00:18:03] And if you like the action scenes, like if that's what you're looking for.

[00:18:07] But if you have no interest in these movies, but you want to see a film that's got great performance in it.

[00:18:15] And I think somebody really just having fun with their role.

[00:18:20] It's Denzel Washington in this movie.

[00:18:22] And, yeah.

[00:18:24] I'm sure we'll be talking about him as we start to talk in the future weeks about predictions for Best Supporting Actor nominations.

[00:18:31] But he's in the mix.

[00:18:32] And after seeing the film last night, I'm like, I totally get it because he is the most Denzel Washington-ish Denzel Washington in this film.

[00:18:42] Sure.

[00:18:42] And he's got all the right – it's the right facial expressions.

[00:18:46] It's the right reactions.

[00:18:47] It's the right tone of voice.

[00:18:48] It's just – and he is having a good time getting to play this character.

[00:18:53] And I love the fact that they let this character go into some very interesting directions that I did not anticipate.

[00:19:01] And that kept me engaged with that performance also because I did not know where it was going for most of the film.

[00:19:07] And that was exhilarating.

[00:19:08] So, yeah.

[00:19:09] Yeah.

[00:19:09] I think it's hard for me to – we had just seen the film last night.

[00:19:13] So we haven't had a lot of processing time.

[00:19:16] I think coming out, I was irritated that it hit, like we've said, a lot of the beats.

[00:19:22] They were so beholden to the first gladiator, like mentioning – I mean showing Russell Crowe on screen.

[00:19:30] Yeah.

[00:19:31] Mentioning his character Maximus.

[00:19:32] Did not like that.

[00:19:33] Mentioning his character Maximus.

[00:19:35] Then showing a ring that had his name in it.

[00:19:37] Like if you took a drink every time Maximus was mentioned or you saw his name, you see a shrine to him two different times at least.

[00:19:46] Yeah.

[00:19:47] I think you'd pass out halfway through this movie because it's so – but as we're sitting here talking and I'm processing, there were things – the character arc of Macronus, Denzel Washington's character, it was more interesting than it could have been.

[00:20:05] Pedro Pascal plays Marcus Acacius.

[00:20:08] Also interesting.

[00:20:09] His character arc is more interesting than it could have been.

[00:20:12] And so there's – but I think somehow it – yeah.

[00:20:17] So I think if they had been able to separate it from the first film and just let this more kind of standalone and let those character arcs happen, this would have been a much better film.

[00:20:26] Yeah, I think you could have done that.

[00:20:27] I think there's a story here.

[00:20:28] I mean granted, obviously this story, it is a direct sequel.

[00:20:32] I mean the story – characters in this film were characters in the first film.

[00:20:36] Things have transpired over the last 20 years.

[00:20:38] We are – you know, I get it.

[00:20:40] But I think Maximus could have been treated much more as a mythical figure that we didn't have to see and hear about as much.

[00:20:47] It's almost like a –

[00:20:48] Yeah, a little bit and then leave it.

[00:20:49] Yeah.

[00:20:49] Because I mean, again, I agree with you.

[00:20:51] Opening credits, we see flashes of what happened in the first film.

[00:20:54] Great.

[00:20:54] Okay.

[00:20:55] We're all there.

[00:20:55] We got it on.

[00:20:56] We're on board.

[00:20:58] Now let's move forward with the story.

[00:21:00] And it just had a hard time wanting to do that.

[00:21:03] I mean it just kept wanting to say, hey, remember that part in the first Gladiator when Maximus did this?

[00:21:08] Okay, we want to make sure you remember that because that was really important.

[00:21:11] And it's just – it was constant.

[00:21:13] I don't think it needed it.

[00:21:15] I think the film didn't have the confidence it needed to just exist on its own.

[00:21:21] Let me talk – can I talk about a couple – you mentioned Pedro Pascal, which I agree.

[00:21:24] I think he's good and I think his character arc was more interesting than I expected on the onset.

[00:21:30] At the beginning of the film, the first 30 to 45 minutes, it seems like they're just going to run the hits of the Gladiator film

[00:21:38] and everybody's playing the same part that their equivalent did in the first movie.

[00:21:42] Right.

[00:21:42] I like the fact that there are a couple of these character arcs like Pedro Pascal's and like Denzel Washington's

[00:21:47] that were a little different, that went in some different directions than I expected

[00:21:51] and that reinvigorated the film for me about halfway through.

[00:21:57] Connie Nielsen, you mentioned playing Lucilia, reprising her role.

[00:22:01] I got to say, A, I thought she was really good and B, I was really happy that the film let her have

[00:22:06] a real good meaty role in this film and not just treat it as a cameo flashback role,

[00:22:13] which is what I thought it was going to be.

[00:22:14] And I was really happy to see that no, she actually has a –

[00:22:17] Beefed up role.

[00:22:18] A real fleshed out role in this film and kind of a pivotal role in this film.

[00:22:22] I'm like, great.

[00:22:23] And she was really good in that role.

[00:22:24] So good stuff all the way around there.

[00:22:27] Other one I'll mention, we had two people playing the co-emperors of Rome at the time.

[00:22:33] Yeah, they split Joaquin Phoenix's character Commodus into basically two people.

[00:22:38] Yeah, two people.

[00:22:38] We have crazy and crazier.

[00:22:40] We're the two emperors, I think.

[00:22:42] Joseph Quinn playing one of them, Emperor Gaeta, and then Fred Hershinger playing Emperor Caracalla.

[00:22:49] And I thought both were really good.

[00:22:51] They were.

[00:22:52] They didn't quite try to shoot for that Joaquin Phoenix phase, which I think was admirable.

[00:22:59] They are definitely going a little more – what's the word I'm looking for with their performance?

[00:23:07] It was very eclectic performances from both of them.

[00:23:11] They weren't going for heavy drama.

[00:23:13] They weren't trying to go for giant melodrama swings like I think did in the first film with the emperor role.

[00:23:22] And their role was also a little less pivotal to the film, honestly, too.

[00:23:26] And I think their role in the film, the people of Rome have kind of gotten fed up with them.

[00:23:32] Yeah, they were on the outs kind of with the public.

[00:23:34] And so you kind of see that and you're – and they played that well like they were just kind of – yeah, like you're crazy and crazier and they're just not making good decisions.

[00:23:43] And kind of – not that they were comedic relief, but I guess in a way they kind of were because they're kind of seen as –

[00:23:48] I guess that's what I'm saying is that their film – their roles were not as dramatically heavy as the Joaquin Phoenix Emperor role was in the first film where his was – you know.

[00:23:58] And Phoenix got derided a lot for his performance, although he got some acclaim for it too.

[00:24:03] But I think people look at it as like a little over the top and trying to lean way heavy into the melodrama of the situation.

[00:24:09] These two this year in this film – no, there's no real melodrama there.

[00:24:13] It is just purely – yes, they are emperors that are despised by the people around them and have lost kind of touch of reality of how to actually run this country.

[00:24:23] And they were good. They were really good, I think, in that role.

[00:24:26] I'd agree.

[00:24:28] All right. So let's talk about Paul Meskel.

[00:24:30] Okay.

[00:24:31] If we can.

[00:24:32] Paul Meskel, I think he's a really good actor.

[00:24:36] I really liked him in –

[00:24:40] After Son or All of Us Strangers?

[00:24:42] All of Us Strangers.

[00:24:42] Got you.

[00:24:44] And I thought he was an interesting casting choice for this role.

[00:24:48] However, I think the way the Lucius character is written and portrayed in this film, it doesn't work.

[00:24:54] That's my take on it.

[00:24:55] I think the film is going to have a hard time connecting with audiences because I think it's a hard time connecting with this character of Lucius.

[00:25:03] You know, I agree.

[00:25:06] And I think I was trying to figure out why it didn't work.

[00:25:11] Because as you said, Paul Meskel, good actor.

[00:25:15] Good actor.

[00:25:15] He's been in other movies that we've liked.

[00:25:16] He's a good actor.

[00:25:18] In the trailer, we saw him all beefed up and like, you know, with the uniform and the beard.

[00:25:24] And you're like, okay, yeah, I see.

[00:25:26] I can totally buy him as –

[00:25:28] Yes.

[00:25:29] And now, you know, I think I can sum it up for why I feel like it didn't work.

[00:25:33] Okay.

[00:25:33] Because Paul Meskel is a good actor, but I don't think he's take a famous person and do this famous person.

[00:25:41] So, for instance, like Butler doing Elvis.

[00:25:46] Yep.

[00:25:46] That worked.

[00:25:46] He could become – or Joaquin Phoenix doing Johnny Cash.

[00:25:50] Yes.

[00:25:50] So, in this sense, it's the character of Maximus from Gladiator.

[00:25:55] Famous, iconic figure.

[00:25:57] Won a lot of – you know, won Oscar as well.

[00:25:59] Acclaim.

[00:26:00] And Paul Meskel is not playing Maximus, but I think he's taking over like embodying the gladiator that we're supposed to think about.

[00:26:07] And I think the way the script was written, it was supposed to be like, I feel like I'm watching Maximus.

[00:26:13] And like, no, he's not – he's so much of his own person that it just didn't seem to kind of fit.

[00:26:19] So, getting kind of –

[00:26:20] Yeah.

[00:26:20] Simply put, maybe just miscast.

[00:26:22] I think there's a little miscasting there.

[00:26:24] And also, I think that just the character of Lucius in general in this film, they – I think they fumble a lot in it.

[00:26:30] Okay.

[00:26:31] You and I talked about this last night.

[00:26:33] Sure.

[00:26:33] The very first scene we see, Lucius, we meet him, is an odd scene.

[00:26:39] It is.

[00:26:40] He's kind of getting angry at some chickens or something or trying to do some work out in the farm.

[00:26:45] He's thinking a grain on his – yeah.

[00:26:45] And even his wife is like telling him to like calm down and chill out or whatever.

[00:26:49] And it was just a very odd – it's like we get this very rough, rough personality.

[00:26:55] And I get that that's – throughout the film, even the macronist, the Denzel Washington character, keeps referring to Lucius as rage.

[00:27:02] I see all this rage in you.

[00:27:03] And yeah, we get little senses of that.

[00:27:06] But then we get moments where I think they're trying to make Lucius seem more like Maximus, but it hadn't quite connected because he hadn't really earned that kind of perception yet.

[00:27:16] And then by the end, we're supposed to also believe that he's now completely become like Maximus, but that didn't really connect either.

[00:27:22] It's like – it's just something with the writing of this role and the performance they matched with it.

[00:27:28] Just didn't work.

[00:27:29] I never felt any sense of connection.

[00:27:32] The thing with Russell Crowe in the first Gladiator is you knew within the first few scenes that you see him, you know who this guy is.

[00:27:39] Right.

[00:27:40] Like, I got it.

[00:27:41] I know his deal.

[00:27:43] The words he says, I understand what they mean about him.

[00:27:47] He's – it's a character that you get kind of enamored with by halfway through the film.

[00:27:54] So, Lucius here, I don't feel like it ever worked.

[00:27:58] So, that in general just really helps – it hurts that emotional heart of the film that I said was missing because you have to have that emotional connection to this main character.

[00:28:07] And we don't have it.

[00:28:08] Right.

[00:28:09] And then I think it's just, you know, you keep finding yourself comparing him back to the first film, which is not fair.

[00:28:15] No.

[00:28:15] But that's what you do because you're trying to figure out – you're trying to find something to connect with on this guy.

[00:28:20] In a sequel, you can't help but usually refer back.

[00:28:22] So, I think it's just – again, I think Paul Meskel did the best he could with what he was given.

[00:28:27] I think the character in general had some sloppy writing behind it and couldn't decide, do we make this guy his own person or do we want to make him just a clone of Maximus or are we doing a weird hybrid in between?

[00:28:39] And it's just never quite settled on that.

[00:28:43] Yeah, there's actually a turn, a personality turn on Lucius at one point in the film where we're supposed to believe that he now feels a different way towards some other people around him.

[00:28:56] And I did not buy it for one second because nothing I've seen makes me believe that there was warranted that change.

[00:29:03] But that change is critical to the rest of the film.

[00:29:05] So, it's like it has to happen from a plot standpoint but nothing in the character's writing and scripting.

[00:29:11] It makes me feel like that that was earned in any way, shape or form.

[00:29:15] So, I think that may be the biggest fault of this film is just that Lucius character, the way it was written and performed.

[00:29:22] Which is a pretty –

[00:29:23] It's important.

[00:29:24] It's important.

[00:29:24] And it just makes the whole film just not have that connection to the audience that I think it really sorely needed.

[00:29:31] Yeah, we haven't talked a lot about director Ridley Scott who did direct the first one.

[00:29:38] And I think he is 86 years old.

[00:29:42] Amazing.

[00:29:42] And I think it is amazing that he is still making movies and still making ones of this scope.

[00:29:47] I mean, grand, it's not just he's one man out there doing everything.

[00:29:50] Yes, he has a huge crew.

[00:29:51] But just that he is the head director making all these things happen.

[00:29:56] It's very impressive to me that he's 86 and made this film.

[00:30:00] Agreed.

[00:30:01] But –

[00:30:02] And I don't –

[00:30:02] I think he's still –

[00:30:03] You know, he knows how to create a spectacle.

[00:30:05] He did it with Napoleon.

[00:30:06] He did it with this.

[00:30:07] The difference is, I think –

[00:30:10] Or the weak point, as you mentioned, is the script and the Paul Meskel character, I think, specifically.

[00:30:16] And other things, like you're saying, the Denzel Washington character worked.

[00:30:21] Pedro Pascal's character worked.

[00:30:23] The shared emperor role worked.

[00:30:26] You know, some interesting fight scenes do happen.

[00:30:30] Yes, sometimes CGI is a little irritating just because it's there.

[00:30:33] You use it and maybe you shouldn't.

[00:30:35] But enough of it worked.

[00:30:38] But it just – I think where it falls short is kind of the script like you were saying.

[00:30:43] And I will say we reviewed Napoleon when it came out last year.

[00:30:48] And that went to Apple TV Plus pretty quickly.

[00:30:53] I liked this overall better.

[00:30:56] And maybe it's because it's not trying to be –

[00:30:59] You know, Napoleon, obviously, a real person.

[00:31:01] It was trying to be more historically accurate and, like, give you a character portrayal.

[00:31:06] Whereas this, you know, is based more on an action movie.

[00:31:08] So if I'm giving a positive to this film as well, I always try to find positives.

[00:31:14] The film was two and a half hours.

[00:31:17] And for me, it moved.

[00:31:20] Whereas I feel like that was one of the problems with Napoleon.

[00:31:21] It was a little sluggish for me.

[00:31:23] But this, I felt like mood.

[00:31:26] And I think you and I, I guess, like you're saying, kind of maybe on the positive with the film.

[00:31:33] No, I am.

[00:31:33] I am still positive.

[00:31:35] I mean, look, it is still a – it's a really good spectacle, epic action film.

[00:31:42] It's got some great set pieces.

[00:31:44] It's – if the first Gladiator film did not exist.

[00:31:48] Taking this solely on its virtues, which –

[00:31:50] I do think that would actually make this film a little better.

[00:31:53] It may be a little harder to make this film work with all the references to the first film.

[00:31:58] You'd have to, like, really create some interesting backstory.

[00:32:00] Right.

[00:32:01] But it could work.

[00:32:02] And I actually think it would be better.

[00:32:04] I think the fact that the first one does exist and we're watching the second one hurts it.

[00:32:09] Because the things that worked so well in the first movie didn't work here.

[00:32:14] And that's a shame.

[00:32:16] But – and I think it does hinge on that lead character, that lead performance role.

[00:32:21] Sure.

[00:32:22] And that lack of emotional connection to the film.

[00:32:25] But overall, it is still a rousing time at the cinema.

[00:32:29] I mean, look, I – not a lot of films look like Gladiator 2.

[00:32:35] Not a lot of films feel like Gladiator 2.

[00:32:37] It's still a fun, interesting film to watch.

[00:32:40] And, you know, if you like – Jimmy, if you like Gladiator movies, this is a good Gladiator movie.

[00:32:46] I mean, it's a – it is good for that time period, for that culture, for the action and the adventure that goes along with it.

[00:32:55] It all works.

[00:32:56] It's just –

[00:32:57] And it's, you know –

[00:32:58] It needed that extra element, the layer on top of it to elevate this to a great film.

[00:33:03] Gotcha.

[00:33:03] And it didn't have it.

[00:33:04] So it just has to hover in the okay to good film category.

[00:33:10] Yeah.

[00:33:11] At one point, Lucius, in kind of a prisoner revolting moment, has a sword and he's killing somebody.

[00:33:23] And he says a line, roughly – I'm not sure the exact wording – but a sword, whether metal or wood, still has a point.

[00:33:30] Mm-hmm.

[00:33:31] And I immediately thought, you know, I wish this film had more of one.

[00:33:36] Oh, wow.

[00:33:36] So that actually occurred to me while I was watching the film, which is not a good thing if I can think of, like, things to say during a review when something has a response to a line of dialogue.

[00:33:46] Mm-hmm.

[00:33:46] Probably not – probably not good.

[00:33:48] But, yeah.

[00:33:48] Well, that's a good line there, Chris.

[00:33:50] Yeah.

[00:33:50] You've got a – you've had a few really good lines in this episode.

[00:33:53] I just want to give you some credit on that.

[00:33:54] That was – it was good.

[00:33:56] Especially if it wasn't one you, like, had to research or write out.

[00:33:58] I mean, it just came to you naturally.

[00:33:59] Yeah.

[00:33:59] So it was good.

[00:34:00] While sitting in the theater.

[00:34:01] Well, very nice.

[00:34:02] That is Gladiator 2.

[00:34:04] Again, yeah, I'm going to come out on the generally positive – just because, you know, I do get people asking.

[00:34:11] They like the star ratings.

[00:34:12] They like it when we kind of put a star rating to it, just because it kind of gives them a walking away, knowing of this is where we are on a rating scale with this film.

[00:34:20] Because it could be easy to listen to this whole diatribe, and then you're like, well, I don't really understand if Alan liked it or not.

[00:34:26] So the star rating kind of gives you that sense.

[00:34:30] I like to think that we're generally nice people.

[00:34:33] Yeah.

[00:34:34] For the most part.

[00:34:36] So, yeah, sometimes we may end up being more positive than we actually are on a film.

[00:34:40] So star ratings just kind of give people a definitive like, where do you fall?

[00:34:44] This is where we are.

[00:34:45] Yeah.

[00:34:45] I think I'm at three.

[00:34:48] Okay.

[00:34:49] I think I'm at three on this.

[00:34:52] Maybe because of Denzel Washington, I could bump up to three and a half.

[00:34:55] Oh, okay.

[00:34:56] Maybe.

[00:34:57] Okay.

[00:34:57] The more I think about it, the more I kind of want to see his performance again, and that would be the reason I would watch this movie again.

[00:35:03] I don't know if there's any other reason I would want to watch this movie again, other than his performance.

[00:35:09] So I'm waffling between three and three and a half because of the Denzel factor.

[00:35:14] Fair.

[00:35:14] But I'm definitely not any higher than that.

[00:35:16] This is not a four star movie.

[00:35:18] We're glad to get her.

[00:35:19] The first one is in that four and a half star level for me.

[00:35:22] So I'm, you know, I think I am, I am less, less favorable to the film.

[00:35:28] And I think Denzel Washington is definitely worth giving an extra half star.

[00:35:33] My question is, is it up from two to two and a half or is it from two and a half to three?

[00:35:39] That's, that's kind of like, so I don't know.

[00:35:41] I'll have to sit with it a little more.

[00:35:43] You know what?

[00:35:44] I'm going to go ahead and just hone in.

[00:35:45] I'm at three.

[00:35:46] Okay.

[00:35:46] I'm at three.

[00:35:47] The more I think about it, I'm like, no, this film does not.

[00:35:50] But three and a half to me is the level where I can actually start recommending to people,

[00:35:55] hey, you go go check out this movie.

[00:35:56] It's pretty good.

[00:35:57] In this movie, I'm not there.

[00:35:58] Got you.

[00:35:59] So three, three stars for me.

[00:36:00] Fair enough.

[00:36:01] All right.

[00:36:02] Three out of five.

[00:36:03] Chris, is it waffling between two and a half and three?

[00:36:06] Yeah.

[00:36:06] Okay.

[00:36:07] All right.

[00:36:07] So we average probably about 2.75.

[00:36:10] Yeah.

[00:36:10] That makes, I think that that checks out.

[00:36:12] Here's what I want to say to the movie giving public.

[00:36:15] Obviously, Alan and I always champion going to see films out at a theater because we just

[00:36:21] want theaters to survive.

[00:36:22] We like the whole theater going experience watching with an audience.

[00:36:25] And with the spectacles in this thing, the kind of, you know, the Coliseum fights and

[00:36:30] everything.

[00:36:30] Yeah.

[00:36:30] If you are the least bit interested, the theater is the place to see it just because it's up

[00:36:34] on the huge screen.

[00:36:35] It is more impressive.

[00:36:38] Agreed.

[00:36:38] Obviously.

[00:36:39] All right.

[00:36:40] Well, that is Gladiator 2.

[00:36:42] I think it'll do pretty well, pretty well box office wise.

[00:36:45] Well, I hope so.

[00:36:47] Only because I'm hoping for some weird reason that I get, I mean, he's 86.

[00:36:53] I want him, Ridley Scott, to do another alien movie.

[00:36:56] I really do.

[00:36:58] Supposedly he's supposed to be doing it.

[00:36:59] I really, because yeah, I'm on the record.

[00:37:01] I really love Prometheus, you know, alien Romulus.

[00:37:04] Okay.

[00:37:04] But like, I just think something about the way he kind of, when he made Prometheus, he's

[00:37:10] like, I'm going to kind of do what I want here.

[00:37:11] And I think he did.

[00:37:12] And I really liked it.

[00:37:13] So for him to kind of take another stab at making another really interesting film.

[00:37:19] So maybe money from this will allow him to do that.

[00:37:21] Who knows?

[00:37:21] We'll see.

[00:37:22] All right.

[00:37:23] Gladiator 2 in movie theaters now.

[00:37:25] We are slightly lukewarm positive on it.

[00:37:29] So, okay.

[00:37:30] Chris, we're going to take a quick break.

[00:37:32] When we come back, I've got a couple of trailers and news items to share.

[00:37:36] And then we'll end with our early predictions on the best picture race for the 2025 Oscars.

[00:37:44] So stay tuned.

[00:37:45] You're listening to Foot Candle Films here on The Mesh.

[00:37:47] We'll be right back.

[00:37:48] This podcast is sponsored by Jackson Creative, a custom communication agency located in downtown

[00:37:55] Hickory, North Carolina, specializing in online content creation.

[00:38:00] To learn more, visit thejacksoncreative.com.

[00:38:04] Jackson Creative, we tell your story.

[00:38:08] Welcome back to Foot Candle Films here on the Mesh.tv podcast network.

[00:38:13] Let's talk about a couple of trailers.

[00:38:16] And by trailers, I basically mean films coming out in the very near future.

[00:38:20] Obviously, if they're far enough along to have a trailer out, that means that they are within

[00:38:24] probably months of release.

[00:38:28] All right.

[00:38:29] So this first one, Chris, this honestly just came across my news feed this morning.

[00:38:35] And I am more of a curiosity about it than I am anything else.

[00:38:40] Okay.

[00:38:40] Is why I'm bringing it up.

[00:38:42] Well, that seems to be a good thing.

[00:38:45] Curious means.

[00:38:46] Yeah, maybe.

[00:38:47] But curious in a.

[00:38:49] Yeah.

[00:38:50] I'll explain what this all means when I introduce the film.

[00:38:52] So Disney has been doing this whole thing and we've kind of had some slight bemoaning about

[00:38:59] it for years now.

[00:39:00] This whole adapting their classic animated films into live action versions.

[00:39:06] Yeah.

[00:39:06] We have Snow White that's coming down the plot.

[00:39:08] We do.

[00:39:08] Snow White is coming next.

[00:39:10] Or is that, I guess, or maybe Mufasa technically.

[00:39:14] Well, the Lion King, the Mufasa, the Lion King prequel.

[00:39:17] Right.

[00:39:18] Is in that camp.

[00:39:19] I mean, it's not based off an animated.

[00:39:21] It's not a redoing of an animated.

[00:39:23] We have a Mufasa animated version.

[00:39:24] Right, right.

[00:39:24] But there is basically a quote prequel to the live action Lion King version that they did.

[00:39:29] Yeah, you're right.

[00:39:31] I'm not a fan of it.

[00:39:32] I haven't really found any of these live action adaptations to be anything more unique

[00:39:37] than the original animated version.

[00:39:39] I think the one that I remember that you kind of liked was Jungle Book.

[00:39:43] Yeah, the Jungle Book one was okay.

[00:39:45] That was one of the earlier ones.

[00:39:46] It was.

[00:39:47] It was.

[00:39:47] And I actually found myself kind of liking the really kind of odd Peach Dragon live action

[00:39:55] version that who was the director who did that.

[00:40:00] The same guy who did the Green Knight.

[00:40:02] Yes.

[00:40:02] And I'm blanking on his name right now.

[00:40:03] I am too, unfortunately.

[00:40:04] Anyway, that I thought was at least interesting.

[00:40:07] David Lowery.

[00:40:07] David Lowery.

[00:40:08] There you go.

[00:40:09] But all the other ones, the Aladdin, the Lion King, the, you know, it's like, ah, okay,

[00:40:15] here we go again.

[00:40:16] The Little Mermaid.

[00:40:17] Cruella.

[00:40:18] The Two Maleficents.

[00:40:20] But that has kind of all been in the Disney camp all this time.

[00:40:24] Pretty much Disney movies doing that deal.

[00:40:26] Because Disney has had the classic animated films that they could rely on and pull from.

[00:40:30] Sure.

[00:40:31] So when I found that the headline came across this morning that there is a now a live action

[00:40:36] version of How to Train Your Dragon.

[00:40:40] Oh.

[00:40:41] Yeah.

[00:40:42] See, that was kind of my reaction too.

[00:40:44] This is Universal Studios.

[00:40:45] They had a back in the 2010s.

[00:40:48] It was a successful franchise of animated films.

[00:40:50] I think three of them.

[00:40:51] Okay.

[00:40:52] And I liked the first one.

[00:40:54] I actually think that How You Train Your Dragon was a fun movie.

[00:40:57] I liked it.

[00:40:58] I like dragons.

[00:40:59] I like the flying sequences.

[00:41:02] And I like the relationship between the young boy and the dragon.

[00:41:05] It was, I liked it.

[00:41:06] I thought it was good.

[00:41:08] But yeah.

[00:41:09] So this is where they're going now.

[00:41:12] Universal released the trailer.

[00:41:13] It was the popular DreamWorks animation feature back when it came out as an animated film.

[00:41:19] So there is a teaser trailer out for this live action How to Train Your Dragon.

[00:41:25] And it's starring Mason Thames, who was in The Black Phone.

[00:41:29] Oh.

[00:41:30] He was the young boy in that film.

[00:41:32] Okay.

[00:41:32] He plays Hiccup, who was the lead young kid.

[00:41:36] Right.

[00:41:36] Nico Parker.

[00:41:37] I'm not familiar with her as Astrid.

[00:41:40] And then Julian Dennison from Deadpool 2 and from Hunt for the Wilder People.

[00:41:45] Yeah.

[00:41:45] He is playing as Fishlegs Ingerman, which is one of the kids, one of the friends.

[00:41:51] Gerard Butler is going to be playing the father.

[00:41:53] He voiced that character in the trilogy of the animated films.

[00:41:56] But he is going to be playing in the live action, the father of this.

[00:42:03] But here's my biggest question or issue.

[00:42:05] Who's it directed by?

[00:42:07] That's a good question.

[00:42:09] Dean DeVloy, who wrote and directed all three animated films.

[00:42:12] Huh.

[00:42:12] So the same person who did the animated films is directing the live action.

[00:42:17] Interesting.

[00:42:18] The Dragon, Chris.

[00:42:20] Let's just show the teaser trailer.

[00:42:22] It's going to be CGI, Alan.

[00:42:23] It's not going to be a real one.

[00:42:24] Sorry.

[00:42:25] I know.

[00:42:25] They are going to rely on CGI.

[00:42:27] I realize that.

[00:42:28] And I was disappointed to hear that.

[00:42:31] Sure.

[00:42:31] Here's my issue.

[00:42:32] And I'll show you in the teaser trailer.

[00:42:34] The design of the Dragon, exactly like the animated version.

[00:42:40] Oh.

[00:42:40] Like, exactly.

[00:42:42] So it looks like the original Pete's Dragon did in Pete's Dragon,

[00:42:46] where they just lifted an animated character and stuck it on film.

[00:42:49] It's like, they've done that?

[00:42:52] Oh, the anime with Pete's Dragon?

[00:42:54] The original Pete's Dragon, the Disney version, it was live action, but then they drew the dragon on the film.

[00:43:01] So hopefully it's not that.

[00:43:02] That would be an interesting route to take.

[00:43:04] Well, my whole issue, just I didn't understand with this, is, okay, you're making this more live action depiction of this animated story,

[00:43:13] but yet the main character of the dragon looks exactly like he does in the animated film, like cartoonish almost.

[00:43:20] Wow.

[00:43:20] Okay.

[00:43:21] I don't get it.

[00:43:22] Anyway, let's watch the trailer, the teaser trailer for DreamWorks, How to Train Your Dragon, the live action version.

[00:43:29] Here we go.

[00:43:56] All right.

[00:44:03] All right.

[00:44:03] That truly was a teaser, very, very short trailer, but you get the sense of, you know, kind of where they're going with this.

[00:44:10] And again, I just, I just find myself asking, you know, why?

[00:44:15] Yeah, I think that's my, like, I understand what you're saying.

[00:44:18] Like, it's not like cell animation drawn, but it just looks so.

[00:44:24] Oh, right.

[00:44:24] Yeah.

[00:44:25] Yeah.

[00:44:25] No, it's, it's the exact CG.

[00:44:27] I mean, the, the original animated was a CGI film and this one is that same.

[00:44:32] It just, yeah.

[00:44:33] I just, why would you make the dragon look exactly like it in the anime when you have a chance to make something even more realistic looking to match the rest of the film?

[00:44:43] And I don't know.

[00:44:44] I'm confused by that.

[00:44:45] But anyway.

[00:44:47] Yeah.

[00:44:47] And I guess.

[00:44:48] Unfortunately, it feels like it's a marketing thing.

[00:44:50] It's like, well, everybody knows the look of that dragon.

[00:44:53] You gotta make toothless look really realistic.

[00:44:53] Yeah.

[00:44:53] We don't want drag.

[00:44:54] We don't want the dragon to look more realistic and be scary looking or whatever.

[00:44:58] It's like, no, let's, let's make him just as playful and fun and looking as before.

[00:45:02] Yeah.

[00:45:02] And I, I'm with you.

[00:45:04] I mean, I, I wasn't as, I wasn't really that into the original ones.

[00:45:09] I mean, they were fine, but I am left kind of wondering, yeah, why?

[00:45:14] Because if you're doing everything so similar, why wouldn't people just go for the animated one?

[00:45:20] I don't know.

[00:45:21] Yeah.

[00:45:21] Yeah.

[00:45:21] Agreed.

[00:45:22] Well, that's coming out in June.

[00:45:24] Okay.

[00:45:24] So how to train your dragon, a live action.

[00:45:27] If it's successful, Chris, that means that we have crossed over.

[00:45:30] We are no longer just in Disney territory for making, uh, live action versions of animated

[00:45:37] films.

[00:45:38] Right.

[00:45:38] I don't know if we'll be expecting an, an iron giant live action movie.

[00:45:43] I don't know if we'll be expecting a Shrek.

[00:45:45] Yeah.

[00:45:45] That's actually possible.

[00:45:48] I mean, again, I asked why, but I guess they think, and I guess they're proven right that

[00:45:54] enough people are just curious about how they'll pull it off or something or.

[00:45:59] Yeah.

[00:46:00] Yeah.

[00:46:00] Cause it is a curiosity.

[00:46:01] That's kind of the whole deal behind it.

[00:46:02] It's like, you don't go because you want to see, Oh, I want to see how they tell the story

[00:46:06] differently.

[00:46:06] No, everybody's wants to see the same.

[00:46:08] It's the same story.

[00:46:09] It's like, so why would you go?

[00:46:11] It is a kind of a curiosity.

[00:46:12] How are they going to make this animated film be a live action version?

[00:46:17] So, all right.

[00:46:19] Uh, yeah, I was just more surprised when I heard that.

[00:46:22] You said you were curious, but didn't mean it was, yeah.

[00:46:25] I mean, it's in a good way.

[00:46:26] Um, yeah.

[00:46:27] Okay.

[00:46:28] Let's, uh, let's, let's, let's move on and talk about one other trailer that I haven't

[00:46:32] got to watch yet, but I am very, very also curious about, but in a good way.

[00:46:37] Um, you and I have both seen the film, the substance.

[00:46:43] Yes.

[00:46:43] Um, they're doing an animated version.

[00:46:45] Yes, that's right.

[00:46:46] They're going the other direction.

[00:46:47] It's going to be a fully animated CGI version of the, of the substance.

[00:46:51] No.

[00:46:51] So, uh, what the substance has got a lot of press for because it's Demi Moore.

[00:46:57] Yeah.

[00:46:57] Kind of coming back.

[00:46:58] You know, she was obviously a, um, icon, uh, actress, you know, eighties and in the nineties,

[00:47:03] um, uh, big movie star, but we also haven't seen her in a lot of things in the last year,

[00:47:09] 15 years.

[00:47:10] So she comes back, she makes this kind of big, a big showy performance in the substance

[00:47:14] playing an aging actress.

[00:47:17] And, uh, you know, I think the film got a lot of acclaim or attention because of that.

[00:47:20] And then it's gone on to get some attention for other aspects of the film and, uh, the

[00:47:25] film itself.

[00:47:26] But it is interesting.

[00:47:28] I think we're seeing a little bit of a Renaissance of some of these actresses, especially ones

[00:47:32] that are, we're seeing more as sex symbols, maybe than necessarily quote actresses back

[00:47:40] in the day.

[00:47:41] Coming back and now getting into some actual acting and Pamela Anderson is the one I'm going

[00:47:47] to bring up that kind of fits this, this mold here.

[00:47:50] There's a film now, uh, trailers released and we're going to watch it here in a second called

[00:47:55] the last show girl.

[00:47:56] It is Pamela Anderson.

[00:47:58] That is yes, that Pam Anderson, the one that's a Baywatch.

[00:48:02] Uh, some of the movies that she was in back in the nineties, uh, big barbed wire barbed

[00:48:09] wire.

[00:48:10] Yeah.

[00:48:10] Was one big international sex symbol.

[00:48:12] Uh, Tommy Lee, the whole relationship thing, you know, had a mini series about her in that

[00:48:16] relationship.

[00:48:17] Anyway, she is a actress in the film, the last show girl.

[00:48:22] It takes place in, uh, Las Vegas and it's a Pamela Anderson starring as Shelley, a veteran

[00:48:29] show girl who finds herself at a crossroads with her stage production on its last legs.

[00:48:33] So again, kind of getting this whole idea of someone who had a heyday back in the day.

[00:48:38] And now she's kind of at the later stages of a career trying to either make a little

[00:48:43] bit of a comeback or trying to make some sort of a statement about her work.

[00:48:47] So again, I kind of relate it to the Demi Moore performance.

[00:48:51] We got in the substance.

[00:48:52] It sounds like they're going for a little bit of that same feeling here.

[00:48:55] This has got a really interesting cast along with it.

[00:48:57] Uh, Karen and Shipka.

[00:48:59] Brenda Song, Billy Lord, Dave Bautista and Jamie Lee Curtis are all also in this film.

[00:49:05] Okay.

[00:49:06] Um, and yeah, I'm just saying the early critics who have screened this, seen this film, uh,

[00:49:12] varieties, Peter DeBruge says, uh, you know, Anderson's performance is a quote force of nature.

[00:49:18] So that, uh, I'm interested to see.

[00:49:22] Um, so the last show girl, we're going to show the trailer for that right now.

[00:49:26] And we'll talk to about it here on the other side.

[00:49:42] Places, please.

[00:49:46] Places, please.

[00:49:49] This is your place's call.

[00:49:52] For the final performance of the razzle dazzle.

[00:49:59] Me and Las Vegas used to treat us like movie stars.

[00:50:05] Costumes.

[00:50:09] We were ambassadors.

[00:50:10] For style and grace.

[00:50:15] The Las Vegas show girl.

[00:50:21] All right.

[00:50:22] So that was the trailer for the last show girl.

[00:50:24] And yeah, I'm was remiss in not mentioning, uh, Gia Coppola was director.

[00:50:29] So obviously the word Coppola you hear in the name, there's some family connection there.

[00:50:34] I'm not familiar with Gia Coppola.

[00:50:36] Are we, are we familiar?

[00:50:38] I have seen, she's made a couple of films.

[00:50:41] Uh, the last one I saw, I think it was a 2020 release called, um, mainstream and it had Andrew

[00:50:47] Garfield and it was about like kind of, uh, YouTube sincere people trying to take advantage

[00:50:52] of YouTube and like become stars, become famous.

[00:50:55] Um, so that I've only seen one of her, only one of them from her.

[00:51:00] Okay.

[00:51:00] Yeah.

[00:51:00] It was, I had not really heard a lot about this film.

[00:51:04] Um, so interesting.

[00:51:05] Yeah, no, I'm, I'm, I'm on board.

[00:51:08] I'm excited to see it.

[00:51:09] So, uh, again, I love any film where we get to see a different aspect of an actor or actress

[00:51:16] performer in any way that we hadn't seen before.

[00:51:19] And it looks like we're actually getting a great performance out of Pamela Anderson,

[00:51:23] which I'd never would have thought I would have said.

[00:51:25] And over the last 20 years.

[00:51:27] So, yeah, to me, it looks like, uh, Gia Coppola is giving us kind of a Sean Baker, Quentin

[00:51:34] Tarantino hybrid.

[00:51:35] It does have a lot of that.

[00:51:36] Let me explain what I mean by that.

[00:51:37] Um, Tarantino taking actors, John Travolta, who you haven't seen in a while and putting

[00:51:43] him in something like Pulp Fiction.

[00:51:44] So that's kind of taking Pamela Anderson and put her into something like this.

[00:51:48] But then kind of the showgirl aspect, taking something that people see maybe as laughable

[00:51:53] or not as glamorous and all that.

[00:51:55] That's kind of a Sean Baker thing, like making those people real.

[00:51:58] So yeah.

[00:51:59] And even some of the shots look very Sean Baker as to me.

[00:52:03] So, um, yeah.

[00:52:04] Interesting.

[00:52:05] Well, I'm, I'm very, very interested in the film.

[00:52:07] Uh, does it have on there listed what the release date is?

[00:52:10] Do you already have, do you still have that YouTube video?

[00:52:12] Okay.

[00:52:12] All right.

[00:52:13] I can't remember what the release date was on that.

[00:52:15] Um, shoot.

[00:52:18] Well, I wish I knew if only we had, you know, our intern here today, but he took the day

[00:52:25] off.

[00:52:25] He did.

[00:52:26] So he's waiting in line to get wicked tickets probably.

[00:52:29] So there's another, that's what he's doing.

[00:52:31] Yes.

[00:52:32] The last showgirl is scheduled to be released January 10th.

[00:52:35] Oh, so coming out very soon here.

[00:52:37] Gotcha.

[00:52:37] Uh, I would imagine probably limited release.

[00:52:40] Um, but yeah, we will see.

[00:52:41] And then Gia Coppola director, uh, did Palo Alto in 2013.

[00:52:47] That's right.

[00:52:47] I've seen that.

[00:52:48] Okay.

[00:52:49] Uh, mainstream you mentioned 2020.

[00:52:51] Um, yeah, I think that's the two, the two films that she's done.

[00:52:57] So, okay.

[00:52:58] All right.

[00:52:59] Well, we will see how the last showgirl ends up coming when it comes out in January.

[00:53:03] All right.

[00:53:04] Uh, last thing I want to do Chris is, uh, is, you know, November, we're getting very

[00:53:10] close to the end of the year.

[00:53:11] Yes.

[00:53:12] There's still some films to come out between now and December, but just so everybody's

[00:53:17] on the same calendar here, you know, we're talking that nominations for the Academy Awards,

[00:53:22] the, the pinnacle of film achievement awards in my mind.

[00:53:26] Yes.

[00:53:27] Get announced.

[00:53:28] What in like late January?

[00:53:30] I think so.

[00:53:31] And then the awards are in March.

[00:53:33] Oh, early March.

[00:53:34] They've announced Conan O'Brien.

[00:53:35] Conan O'Brien, which I think is great.

[00:53:37] I think it's exciting about that.

[00:53:39] So yeah, so we're, we're about two months away from nominations and there will still be

[00:53:43] some films being released, but it's not too early.

[00:53:45] I don't think to start talking about where are we shaping up right now?

[00:53:49] I kind of ask this question occasionally on the show.

[00:53:51] What do we think are kind of rising to the top as the quote best films of the year, at

[00:53:57] least from a general consensus.

[00:53:59] So I always look to variety.

[00:54:01] That's like my go-to publication.

[00:54:02] I think that they're reporting on everything and their predictions on the Oscars are normally

[00:54:07] pretty good.

[00:54:08] And they have put together their predictions as of now.

[00:54:12] And of course, these are subject to change, but, um,

[00:54:14] Are you, are you telling me that if I want to cheat on our Oscar contest that we have

[00:54:20] at the end of the year, when we have the Oscars and we have our foot candle society, great

[00:54:23] that I should try to look to fill my ballot.

[00:54:26] I should look to variety.

[00:54:27] I'm going to say that I, uh, I, I'm, I can either confirm or deny that I may use the variety

[00:54:36] predictions when filling out my Oscar ballots.

[00:54:38] Ah, got you.

[00:54:39] Uh, my predictions anyway.

[00:54:41] Okay.

[00:54:41] So let's just focus in on one category.

[00:54:43] Maybe in the next few weeks, we'll talk about some of the other ones like the actor

[00:54:46] actresses and so forth and director.

[00:54:49] But right now let's just focus in on best picture.

[00:54:52] Okay.

[00:54:52] The, the big, the big enchilada.

[00:54:54] Cause I, I think this is an interesting list of predictions for best picture nominees for

[00:55:00] this year.

[00:55:00] And they still, they do 10 for this, right?

[00:55:03] That's kind of, well, I think the, the rule is they can do up to 10.

[00:55:06] They don't have to do 10.

[00:55:07] Academy is not obligated to do 10.

[00:55:09] They could do nine.

[00:55:10] They could do seven.

[00:55:11] They could do whatever.

[00:55:12] I think it's just up to 10.

[00:55:13] It's kind of the, cause it used to be everything was five.

[00:55:16] It was five.

[00:55:16] And the reason they expanded it, at least in the backstage lore is that films like the

[00:55:24] dark night being like one of the biggest films of the year at the time.

[00:55:28] And also very, you know, very, uh, populist people, you know, like that film with just

[00:55:35] five nominees, a film like that wouldn't have made the cut for not best picture nominee.

[00:55:40] And they were losing audience because the five top typically tended to be more artsy and more

[00:55:46] independent films.

[00:55:47] And by broadening it out to up to 10, they could include more mainstream films in the, in the

[00:55:52] mix and keep people engaged with the awards show.

[00:55:56] That was kind of the thinking behind it.

[00:55:58] I think.

[00:55:59] So I'm going to list out the 10 films that right now, variety is saying this is their current

[00:56:04] as of here, November 20th, their estimated date for predictions for best picture nominees.

[00:56:11] And we'll just kind of bat through these and see how our takes on it.

[00:56:14] I'll go ahead and say, I know you and I have seen one, two, three, four.

[00:56:19] We've seen four of them collectively together.

[00:56:21] And you have seen another one, maybe two of these beyond that.

[00:56:25] Okay.

[00:56:26] And there's still two or three of these that have not been officially released yet.

[00:56:29] So we're, we're not able to have seen them.

[00:56:31] So, okay, here we go.

[00:56:33] Anora.

[00:56:34] We actually reviewed last week on that Sean Baker film that you just mentioned.

[00:56:38] Sean didn't name drop of Sean Baker a minute ago.

[00:56:41] Anora is on the list of potential best picture nominees.

[00:56:45] Blitz.

[00:56:46] Blitz is a film that is an Apple original films on Apple TV.

[00:56:50] We have not seen that.

[00:56:51] I think it's coming out November 22nd.

[00:56:55] Okay.

[00:56:55] So here very, very soon.

[00:56:56] Yeah.

[00:56:56] So that'll be one that at least I know we'll be able to catch up with here soon, but that

[00:57:01] is already got some buzz behind it as a potential best picture nominee.

[00:57:04] As Steve McQueen director, uh, Circa Ronan is a co-star in it.

[00:57:08] She's not the lead.

[00:57:09] Okay.

[00:57:10] Uh, because she's being possibly kicked around as best supporting actress for that film as

[00:57:14] well.

[00:57:15] Okay.

[00:57:16] Then we have a film, the brutalist.

[00:57:18] This is one you mentioned a few weeks ago and we watched the trailer for, um, it's got

[00:57:23] a long epic film.

[00:57:25] I think it's like almost three hours or right at three hours or is it closer to four?

[00:57:29] I think it may be closer to four.

[00:57:31] Like three, three and a half film hours.

[00:57:32] Uh, is an A24 film, but that is getting some early buzz to say, yes, this could be in the

[00:57:38] mix and definitely from the trailer we watched.

[00:57:40] Yeah.

[00:57:40] It looks like it could be a Adrian Brody's.

[00:57:44] Yeah.

[00:57:44] Adrian Brody is the starring role in that.

[00:57:45] It definitely looks like a best picture nominee, at least on the, on the surface.

[00:57:51] Uh, Conclave, which we reviewed several weeks ago, uh, with Ray Fines.

[00:57:55] Uh, that is a nice refraining from saying it like conquest from the white stretch.

[00:58:00] Oh, I know.

[00:58:01] I keep wanting to say that.

[00:58:03] I, I have found myself singing since you mentioned to the tune of conquest.

[00:58:08] Yeah.

[00:58:09] That's the only way I can hear it in my head.

[00:58:10] Um, that is by focus features their film.

[00:58:13] Uh, yeah.

[00:58:15] So we'll circle back to that in a second.

[00:58:17] We're looking at two right now that we've, we've seen, we've seen a North

[00:58:19] and Conclave.

[00:58:21] Uh, the, out of the fours.

[00:58:22] All right.

[00:58:22] Okay.

[00:58:23] Here we go.

[00:58:23] Number five.

[00:58:24] And then let me run through these and then we'll kind of go back and give her, our analysis.

[00:58:28] Yeah.

[00:58:28] Uh, Dune part two.

[00:58:30] Okay.

[00:58:31] And keep in mind that was released this year.

[00:58:32] That was early this year.

[00:58:33] It came out.

[00:58:34] Um, obviously the sequel to Dune part one.

[00:58:38] Then we have Amelia Perez.

[00:58:40] Now this is a film that I brought up in our news section months ago when it premiered at

[00:58:45] Cairns and we talked about how it was getting so much attention.

[00:58:49] It is a musical dealing with the drug trade and transgenderism.

[00:58:58] And most importantly, how long of a standing ovation did it get?

[00:59:01] I can't.

[00:59:01] I don't remember.

[00:59:02] It was, it was a long one.

[00:59:03] It was considered a big standing ovation at the time, but it's also gotten some divisive

[00:59:10] feedback from what we've seen early, early critics.

[00:59:13] It is a Netflix film.

[00:59:14] It is coming out, I think in the next week, if I remember correctly.

[00:59:18] So that will be available also for us to see.

[00:59:21] I don't think it's available today.

[00:59:22] I think it will be soon though.

[00:59:24] Okay.

[00:59:24] All right.

[00:59:25] So that's Amelia Perez.

[00:59:26] That is a Zoe Saldana.

[00:59:28] It's, um, um, ODR.

[00:59:31] ODR.

[00:59:31] Is that how you say his last name or not?

[00:59:33] ODR, but, um, are you talking about the director?

[00:59:37] Director.

[00:59:37] Yeah.

[00:59:37] Yeah.

[00:59:37] I think so.

[00:59:38] Okay.

[00:59:39] And then, uh, uh, Selena Gomez is also in this.

[00:59:43] Gotcha.

[00:59:43] Okay.

[00:59:44] So that's Amelia Perez, uh, gladiator two, which we reviewed at the first half of this film,

[00:59:49] uh, this podcast episode by Paramount pictures.

[00:59:52] Gladiator two is rumored to be in the mix right now for best picture.

[00:59:56] Okay.

[00:59:57] The room next door.

[00:59:58] Now this is the Pedro Almodovar film that we played the trailer for a couple months ago.

[01:00:03] Uh, Julianne Moore and, um, Tilda Swinton.

[01:00:08] And that one is also being in the conversation and then wicked our beloved wicked coming out

[01:00:15] this weekend.

[01:00:15] Yeah.

[01:00:16] That's a, that's a film, uh, has to do with the wizard of Oz stuff.

[01:00:19] Uh, that is by universal pictures.

[01:00:21] That is also being early rumors of it being in the Oscar race.

[01:00:28] Okay.

[01:00:29] So that is the one, two, three, four, five, that's the 10.

[01:00:31] Okay.

[01:00:32] So 10, 10 predictions that variety is making a grand.

[01:00:36] These are predictions.

[01:00:37] Sure.

[01:00:38] They're not all going to be exactly right, but, uh, it's normally a pretty good stab at it.

[01:00:43] Chris, which one, and I already gave you the answer to this.

[01:00:46] So just pretend like you don't know the answer.

[01:00:47] We were something again in the car ride we talked about, but I already, you already know

[01:00:52] the answer, but just pretend like you don't.

[01:00:53] Sure.

[01:00:53] Which one, which one of these 10 films do you think variety is already predicting will

[01:00:59] be the winner of best picture out of these 10 films?

[01:01:02] I probably would go with conclave.

[01:01:05] Okay.

[01:01:06] Um, for the reasons I think we kind of talked about, maybe we talked about on the show when

[01:01:09] we reviewed the film.

[01:01:10] I mean, it's kind of, it's PG, which is interesting, but it's, you know, so not that it's a family

[01:01:16] film, but it's not offensive.

[01:01:18] It's kind of a thriller, but in a safe way, rough.

[01:01:21] There are a bunch of good actors in it.

[01:01:23] Ray Fonz gives a good performance.

[01:01:24] So yeah, I would, I would probably go with conclave.

[01:01:27] Okay.

[01:01:28] Um, and my apologies, Chris, I skipped one film listing.

[01:01:33] Um, yeah, a real pain, which you have seen.

[01:01:36] Yeah.

[01:01:37] And, uh, Jesse Eisenberg, uh, Karen Colt can, that is a, by searchlight pictures, a real

[01:01:44] pain that is also in the mix.

[01:01:46] Number 10 on the list there.

[01:01:48] Okay.

[01:01:48] Happy to see it in the list.

[01:01:49] So here's what we'll do then.

[01:01:50] So variety went one step further and said, okay, yeah, those are the 10 and kind of

[01:01:54] alphabetical order, but here is their ranking on likelihood to win of the 10.

[01:02:02] Anora is number one.

[01:02:03] So their prediction is that Anora, Anora is going to win.

[01:02:07] That surprises me.

[01:02:07] Yeah.

[01:02:08] But I, I'd be down with that.

[01:02:11] I think it'd be great, but it is a daring choice, I think for best picture winner, but

[01:02:17] we'll see.

[01:02:17] Conclave they have as number two.

[01:02:19] So they do believe, yeah, I do too.

[01:02:21] Conclave, I think has got a safer pathway to best picture.

[01:02:25] Honestly, if you told me right now, said Alan, you've got to go ahead and tell me who is

[01:02:28] going to win best picture.

[01:02:29] Like right now, today I'm going to go conclave.

[01:02:33] And I think the problem I have fallen into in the past, uh, filling out my ballot, which

[01:02:39] Hey, I can't, apparently my number one problem is I do not consult variety.

[01:02:43] But my second problem is I tend to either go with things that I want to win and that nobody

[01:02:49] else does.

[01:02:50] Or I kind of go down the critic rat hole where critics can really like something, but they

[01:02:56] are the only people that really champion it.

[01:02:58] And so like, I can see Anora, lots of movie critics like it.

[01:03:02] We, we like it.

[01:03:03] Those people seem to be over the moon, but are those the people that are actually Academy

[01:03:06] voters?

[01:03:07] I guess that's where my question was.

[01:03:09] Good question.

[01:03:09] Um, so after Anora and conclave, Amelia Perez, they have listed as third.

[01:03:15] Okay.

[01:03:15] Third.

[01:03:16] Most likely that surprises me.

[01:03:17] Yeah.

[01:03:18] Agreed.

[01:03:18] Because of some of the controversy you've talked about in varying reviews, uh, the brutalist

[01:03:23] they have is fourth.

[01:03:25] This one.

[01:03:26] Okay.

[01:03:27] Yeah.

[01:03:27] I was, I was willing to give it a, a, a shadow of a doubt before I saw the film last

[01:03:31] night.

[01:03:32] They've got gladiator two is number five and, um, I don't see it.

[01:03:36] I don't see it.

[01:03:37] I don't either.

[01:03:38] I don't see it.

[01:03:38] Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't get nominated.

[01:03:42] Okay.

[01:03:43] Cause I, I just, I think it's just missing too many elements to make it that best picture

[01:03:49] category.

[01:03:50] So, yeah.

[01:03:52] Even with the expanded field field of 10, you feel like it's still, okay.

[01:03:57] I do.

[01:03:58] I mean, yeah.

[01:03:59] Uh, they've got wicked is number six.

[01:04:02] Okay.

[01:04:02] So in the top six of their, of their, there are two big, big movies, you know, gladiator

[01:04:07] and wicked.

[01:04:07] Both are going to make a lot of money and get a lot of audiences.

[01:04:10] So doom part two, they have a seventh on the list.

[01:04:14] Blitz is eight.

[01:04:16] The room next door is ninth.

[01:04:18] In a real pain is 10.

[01:04:19] So not giving a lot of credence behind some of those films, making it to win the award

[01:04:25] right now.

[01:04:26] It seems to be kind of in the Nora conclave, Amelia Perez, brutalist category of far as

[01:04:32] where they things could go.

[01:04:34] And again, we haven't seen Amelia Perez.

[01:04:35] We haven't seen the brutalist, so we can't really comment on those, but at least between

[01:04:40] a Nora and conclave.

[01:04:42] Yeah.

[01:04:42] I'd like to see a Nora win.

[01:04:44] I liked a Nora better than conclave, but I also think conclave is probably a safer,

[01:04:49] more, uh, a meniable pick for best picture.

[01:04:52] Gotcha.

[01:04:53] Yeah.

[01:04:54] Yeah.

[01:04:54] Understood.

[01:04:55] Um, yeah, it'll be interesting to see who wants to see how that shakes out.

[01:05:00] Agreed.

[01:05:00] Agreed.

[01:05:01] So that is what variety has got predicted for best picture.

[01:05:05] Uh, so Chris, you and I have our list of films.

[01:05:08] We still need to make sure that we're accelerating our catch up on here in the next couple months.

[01:05:14] Right.

[01:05:14] Definitely need to be seen.

[01:05:16] Amelia Perez.

[01:05:16] We'll find out when that's coming out on Netflix and I'm sure we'll probably have a

[01:05:20] review of that whenever it does.

[01:05:22] The brutalist.

[01:05:23] That is a theater release, I believe a 24.

[01:05:27] So hopefully we'll have a chance to see it.

[01:05:29] If it's come, if it's been released yet, um, I don't know.

[01:05:33] Don't know either.

[01:05:33] I mean, they need to hurry up and release it.

[01:05:35] So we have time to watch it because I mean three and a half or whatever hours it's yeah.

[01:05:40] Blitz will be Apple TV coming out this weekend.

[01:05:43] So something to check out there.

[01:05:45] I'm curious with that because I'm reminded of the Apple TV plus release coda.

[01:05:50] Yeah.

[01:05:51] That kind of came out and it was an okay film, but there was not, you know,

[01:05:54] I didn't really know anything about it.

[01:05:55] Right up to the top.

[01:05:56] And all of a sudden, boom, it won best picture.

[01:05:59] Right.

[01:06:00] Yeah.

[01:06:00] And, um, blitz granted what it has for it is Steve McQueen, which is a known quantity,

[01:06:06] 12 years of slave.

[01:06:07] Like he's, you know, he's, he's a big deal.

[01:06:10] Yeah.

[01:06:11] But I hadn't really heard anything actually.

[01:06:13] And the only mention of Saoirse Ronan I'd heard was the out, the film, the outrun.

[01:06:17] So that's what I'd heard.

[01:06:18] But like, and then suddenly grand you're saying she's supporting in this.

[01:06:22] Yeah.

[01:06:22] But, um, yeah.

[01:06:23] So I'm curious about that.

[01:06:24] Yeah.

[01:06:25] No, so blitz.

[01:06:26] We'll need to catch up with, uh, the room next door is a theatrical release.

[01:06:30] Okay.

[01:06:30] Sony pictures classics.

[01:06:31] So that one, that and the brutalists are going to be the ones we got to try to hunt

[01:06:34] down and find a way to see, because they're probably not going to play it.

[01:06:38] The theaters here in our area.

[01:06:40] So we're going to be relying on critics, uh, screener links or other ways to see it in

[01:06:45] real pain.

[01:06:45] You've already seen, I still need to see it, but it has been playing here locally.

[01:06:48] So, uh, just two films we got to hunt down in theaters or screening links.

[01:06:53] The others will be online available.

[01:06:55] So that's good.

[01:06:56] Um, I don't want to go on too much longer, Chris, but variety does have their next 10 in

[01:07:03] line, like 11 through 20 potentials.

[01:07:07] Okay.

[01:07:07] I'm just going to list these out.

[01:07:08] And I'm curious.

[01:07:09] These are, I'm guessing these are ones I've probably seen.

[01:07:12] Um, a little bit more.

[01:07:13] Yeah.

[01:07:13] Well, of the ones that have come out, there's some of these that still have not had official

[01:07:17] releases yet.

[01:07:17] So we wouldn't have seen them anyway.

[01:07:19] I'm sure.

[01:07:19] Okay.

[01:07:20] Actually these next five, we would not have seen yet.

[01:07:22] Oh, okay.

[01:07:23] Yeah.

[01:07:24] Well, let me, let me hear.

[01:07:25] Uh, a complete unknown.

[01:07:26] That's the Bob Dylan biopic with, uh, uh, Timothy Chalamet.

[01:07:30] Yeah.

[01:07:31] That's, that's, that is one that could squeak in there.

[01:07:33] Interesting that it's not in the top 10 now, but okay.

[01:07:35] Anyway, again, this is all varieties predictions, you know, uh, sing, sing, sing.

[01:07:39] Which is a film that, uh, you know, we, uh, a 24 release, uh, Domen, uh, Coleman Domingo,

[01:07:45] Coleman Domingo with that.

[01:07:48] September five.

[01:07:49] Have you heard about this film?

[01:07:50] It's a depiction of the, uh, the Munich games, uh, with the, uh, the, the, the terrorist

[01:07:55] hostage situation that went on and basically the sports broadcaster, like the sports broadcasting

[01:08:01] having to deal with how to report and, and deal with that situation.

[01:08:05] It looks really interesting.

[01:08:06] It's one of those, it seems to be almost like a real time kind of everything happening within

[01:08:10] the couple hours of the film timeframe.

[01:08:13] It looks interesting from the trailer, uh, but it is being batted around as a potential,

[01:08:18] like a little bit of a dark horse for a best picture, even though it's not a sequel.

[01:08:22] Cause obviously, but all I thought about when I saw it was like, right, this is the whole

[01:08:26] Munich that, you know, that film is, man.

[01:08:28] And you know, I thought that was a good film.

[01:08:30] So, but I guess this is just a different aspect.

[01:08:32] Well, it's a, it's from the sports world, because again, this was during the broadcast

[01:08:36] of the Olympics and it seems to be a lot taking place in the control room of the broadcast

[01:08:41] of the Olympics.

[01:08:42] And so I think it's an interesting take on that.

[01:08:44] Right.

[01:08:45] Um, number 14, meaning they're fourth on the backup list of potential nominees, uh,

[01:08:51] Nosferatu, the, uh, David Eggers.

[01:08:53] Okay.

[01:08:54] Um, yeah, I would think that's probably a long shot, but you never know.

[01:08:57] Never know.

[01:08:58] Um, I think it'll get, probably get a lot of love for production design, costuming, some

[01:09:02] of the effects and all, but, um, and maybe script depending on the,

[01:09:06] on how many like could be things they do with it.

[01:09:08] But, uh, inside out too.

[01:09:11] It was down there on the list.

[01:09:12] I think that's a long shot, but you know, uh, I'm still here, uh, by Sony pictures

[01:09:19] classics.

[01:09:19] That is, I don't know that film.

[01:09:24] Like, wow.

[01:09:25] I don't know that one.

[01:09:27] That's not the Joaquin Phoenix.

[01:09:29] No, that's, I'm not here.

[01:09:32] No.

[01:09:34] I don't know.

[01:09:34] But it's not the one where he pretended he was quitting acting.

[01:09:37] Well, no, that was, and that was years ago.

[01:09:38] And it's also not the, uh, Bob Dylan, uh, where different people are playing the Todd

[01:09:45] Haynes film.

[01:09:47] I'm still here.

[01:09:48] I'm still here.

[01:09:48] Okay.

[01:09:48] Yeah.

[01:09:48] I'm not familiar with that.

[01:09:49] I do not know this one.

[01:09:50] All right.

[01:09:50] We have to check that out.

[01:09:51] Uh, the wild robot is mentioned as a animated, obviously an animated film, but you know,

[01:09:57] definitely be in top five, you know, best animated feature.

[01:10:00] Best picture.

[01:10:00] Will it sneak into best picture?

[01:10:02] Yeah, maybe.

[01:10:03] Uh, Saturday night.

[01:10:05] Really?

[01:10:06] Yeah.

[01:10:07] Now, granted, I, I love that movie, but I'll be the first to say it's not a best picture

[01:10:10] nominee, but I do love that movie.

[01:10:13] Um, the piano lesson, which I believe you saw.

[01:10:17] Um, no, it's coming to Netflix.

[01:10:20] Okay.

[01:10:20] So it's, yeah, it's a Netflix film.

[01:10:22] So it hasn't come out yet.

[01:10:23] I don't think so.

[01:10:24] I think it's, yeah, it's on the horizon.

[01:10:26] And the number 20, their last on this list was challengers.

[01:10:29] Now that is the one, that is the one of this whole list.

[01:10:33] I'm like, you know what?

[01:10:34] That should have been up in the top 10 list for me.

[01:10:37] Yeah.

[01:10:37] Because when that came out, it was like buzzy all over the place.

[01:10:39] Luca Guadagnino.

[01:10:40] So yeah, yeah.

[01:10:41] I say take gladiator two out and replace it with challengers.

[01:10:44] And I'm happy with that list.

[01:10:46] So, um, challenges is the one, as I look at this 11 through 20, I'm like, yeah,

[01:10:50] challengers should be in the top 10 in my, in my estimation.

[01:10:53] Um, and then there's still several of these we haven't seen a complete unknown

[01:10:57] sing, sings, September five, Nosferatu.

[01:11:00] I'm still here.

[01:11:02] The wild robot and the piano lesson.

[01:11:04] So yeah, I actually like a majority of these films we haven't seen yet.

[01:11:07] Okay.

[01:11:08] Got some homework to do.

[01:11:09] Yeah.

[01:11:09] So anyway, uh, I'm okay with the top 10 list the way it is.

[01:11:14] Although I would just take gladiator two out of the mix and, uh, put in challengers and

[01:11:19] then I'd be fine.

[01:11:20] So I stated what I thought would win before I knew that.

[01:11:24] Like if you didn't know, if I didn't know what from those 10, would you have picked

[01:11:27] an aura?

[01:11:28] No.

[01:11:29] As far as what I thought would win.

[01:11:30] No, I would say conclave.

[01:11:32] Okay.

[01:11:32] Yeah.

[01:11:32] I think conclave is the safe bet.

[01:11:34] I think variety might be a, is a little daring and hopefully maybe a bit optimistic and maybe

[01:11:39] on, on the factual side that a Nora could win.

[01:11:43] Cause again, I'd love to see that happen.

[01:11:44] I'd love to see Sean Baker when best picture, that would be really cool.

[01:11:48] Yeah.

[01:11:48] So just for his filmmaking style and the subject matter, he typically tackles.

[01:11:53] It just be a, it'd be a really interesting win.

[01:11:55] It would be conclave.

[01:11:57] I think is a safer bet.

[01:11:58] If I was in Vegas betting on it, I'd be going more of the conclave route.

[01:12:02] So.

[01:12:02] Okay.

[01:12:02] Fair enough.

[01:12:03] Okay.

[01:12:04] Well, we got a few more months before we find out for sure how this is all going down.

[01:12:09] We'll talk about some of the other categories in future episodes as we lead up to the nomination.

[01:12:13] So I think that wraps us up for today, Chris.

[01:12:16] Okay.

[01:12:17] We're ready to go.

[01:12:18] If anybody wants to comment on anything we've talked about gladiator to coming out this weekend,

[01:12:22] somebody goes to see it and has some thoughts, uh, that echo or contrary to ours, we'd love

[01:12:27] to hear from you or any other topic we talked about.

[01:12:29] How to, how can they get ahold of us?

[01:12:31] You can send an email to info at footcandle.org.

[01:12:34] You can also follow us on Facebook at foot candle film society, Instagram and threads.

[01:12:39] We're a foot candle film and we are on blue sky as well.

[01:12:42] Alan and I are on letterbox where we just try to track what we're seeing and leave quick

[01:12:46] takes.

[01:12:47] And if you will do us a favor, do us a solid as the kids maybe still say, um, give us a

[01:12:53] star rating, write a review, share with friends or whatever service you receive your favorite

[01:12:56] podcasts on, cause it can help us reach new listeners.

[01:12:59] And we'd appreciate it.

[01:13:02] All right.

[01:13:02] Well, thanks everybody so much for listening to this episode of foot candle films.

[01:13:06] We'll look forward to talking to you next time about more movie reviews, movie news,

[01:13:10] upcoming trailers.

[01:13:12] Chris will probably have some recommendations for us as we get closer into the holiday season.

[01:13:17] So, uh, stay tuned.

[01:13:18] We'll talk to you next time.

[01:13:20] Take care.

[01:13:21] See you in the ticket line.

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