Civil War

[00:00:00] What you want, when you want it, where you want it, this is The MESH.

[00:00:11] Footcandle Films

[00:00:13] Film news and reviews from two guys who really like movies.

[00:00:18] This episode is brought to you by the Footcandle Film Society.

[00:00:23] For a schedule of upcoming screenings and membership information,

[00:00:26] visit the society's website at www.footcandle.org.

[00:00:35] Hello and welcome to Footcandle Films here on the MESH.TV podcast network.

[00:00:40] My name is Alan Jackson with me, Chris Fry.

[00:00:43] We are both with the Footcandle Film Society and the annual Footcandle Film Festival.

[00:00:48] How you doing today, Chris?

[00:00:50] I'm doing good.

[00:00:51] This is one of the anticipated, another one of the anticipated films of mine for 2024

[00:00:57] that we're going to be talking about.

[00:00:59] So I'm looking forward to discussing it and hearing your thoughts.

[00:01:02] Yeah. And the film Chris is referring to is the film Civil War directed by Alex Garland

[00:01:08] and we will be discussing that, giving a review of that here in a second.

[00:01:12] But also we're going to have a news item on some, a movie I just kind of came aware of

[00:01:18] and I'd like to share with Chris some information about a production that's underway

[00:01:23] that we'll be seeing in the coming months.

[00:01:25] As well as I think, Chris, you may have a trailer to share with us about a film.

[00:01:29] A little bit of connective tissue, I think with today's film, at least in terms of an actor,

[00:01:35] I think in the trailer that we'll be seeing if I remember correctly.

[00:01:38] Am I thinking correctly on that?

[00:01:40] Maybe.

[00:01:42] Yes, I think I'm right.

[00:01:44] I'm going to go on record saying I'm right.

[00:01:46] We'll find out when we get there.

[00:01:48] Do you have a recommendation for us today?

[00:01:50] Are you going to do? Oh good.

[00:01:52] We're back to Chris's recommendations.

[00:01:54] I think we took a couple of weeks off, but Chris is back with a recommendation of a film.

[00:01:58] You may want to check out.

[00:02:00] So we'll get to all that in a little bit, but let's go ahead and jump into our main film discussion,

[00:02:04] which is a discussion in review of Alex Garland's Civil War.

[00:02:10] 19 States have succeeded the United States Army ramps up activity.

[00:02:13] The White House issued warnings to the Western forces as well as the Florida Alliance.

[00:02:18] The three-term president assures the uprising will be dealt with swiftly.

[00:02:22] Let me know if you want to try anything on.

[00:02:24] I guess I'll wear this like a pretty huge Civil War going on all across America.

[00:02:29] We just tried to stay out with what we see on the news seems like it's for the best.

[00:02:38] Director Alex Garland's films have posed what ifs.

[00:02:43] What if a robot became self-aware and decided it wanted to be free of the control of its creators?

[00:02:48] Ex machina.

[00:02:50] What if an alien force started to take over our planet and confounded all of our attempts to explain or understand it?

[00:02:55] Annihilation.

[00:02:57] What if as an audience we engage with the chauvinistic behavior of men towards women as a fantastical horror film?

[00:03:04] Men.

[00:03:06] With Civil War Garland shows a what if of a dystopian future when America has been plunged into a war

[00:03:11] between various factions with journalists racing to the White House for an interview with the president before the government is ever thrown.

[00:03:18] Alan, what was your experience with this latest Garland what if?

[00:03:26] So I'm going to go on record and say that I think let me talk about the technical side of this film first.

[00:03:35] Sure.

[00:03:37] Because technically I think this is an amazing film.

[00:03:39] Okay.

[00:03:41] So just so we're on the same page with that from a direction cinematography building of building of tension when there needs to be tension building of realism when we want to be thrown into a very realistic situation.

[00:03:59] I think this film achieves on all fronts.

[00:04:03] Okay.

[00:04:04] But I will say that ultimately the film left me hollow and not sure.

[00:04:11] Not sure, not even sure why this was the theme and the topic that the film need to cover with the title Civil War.

[00:04:20] In other words, I don't understand.

[00:04:24] I'll get into some scenarios and a little bit, but I don't understand why this film.

[00:04:31] Exist.

[00:04:33] Other than from the technical prowess that it showed.

[00:04:37] And I think if you go into this film, at least for me, marveling at the technical prowess, it's an amazing watch.

[00:04:44] If you go into it looking for something.

[00:04:47] I didn't find anything.

[00:04:49] So I explain a little bit more about that from a thematic standpoint and kind of a storytelling standpoint, but technically it's amazing.

[00:04:59] It's just I walked away very hollow feeling.

[00:05:03] I know what we can read into the story.

[00:05:06] I know what kind of preconceived notions we can all bring into the story.

[00:05:08] But on the surface, the film itself didn't give anything in my opinion to chew on and or to discuss except for whatever an audience member may bring into the experience already preconceived notions of their own.

[00:05:25] So that's where I am with the film.

[00:05:27] I think again, technically I'm going to give it a recommendation, but it was it was not what I thought the film could have been should have been or even maybe thought it was trying to be.

[00:05:41] So with that Chris, I'm going to turn it over to you and let you tell me what you thought of the film.

[00:05:45] Well, okay, so this will be an example of an instance had in the past where you and I are completely opposite one another.

[00:05:54] The things that you seem to be.

[00:05:58] Well, okay, we'll start off with the technical aspects of the praise that you did give the film.

[00:06:05] Yeah, I would be on board with all that.

[00:06:08] Sure.

[00:06:10] Where I differ is that the fact that you felt or that you were mentioning like the hollowness and kind of the feeling you had after film.

[00:06:18] I had that same way, but it was what I felt like I was supposed to get from the film to begin with.

[00:06:27] And I feel like that for me.

[00:06:30] I mean, who knows what I heard an interview with Alex Gordon.

[00:06:33] I think you and I both saw it on the Daily Show.

[00:06:36] He was on there talking about a little bit.

[00:06:38] And I felt like and I'd seen the film when I heard the interview and I felt like, yeah, that's kind of the feeling I got from it.

[00:06:43] I can understand why people would see this film and feel that as you kind of said it was hollow.

[00:06:51] And I can see that.

[00:06:53] For instance, you know, the film's called The War.

[00:06:57] I mentioned it was kind of a dystopian future.

[00:07:00] America's plunged into a war between various factions.

[00:07:03] That limited description is all you get as far as what's going on.

[00:07:10] And seeing the trailer like we did and we discussed it earlier on the show.

[00:07:17] And I feel like lots of other filmgoers had notions in their head of what this film was going to be.

[00:07:23] And I think everybody would say like, well, it was that.

[00:07:27] And some would say it's not a very good version of that.

[00:07:30] They didn't explain why this was going on.

[00:07:33] And they didn't explain.

[00:07:36] They're just, well, it's hard to like, but to me that was kind of the point without getting into spoilers.

[00:07:48] Well, there's not spoilers.

[00:07:50] I mean, there is, but there's, I think, a stance that the film took instead of pointing fingers, which going to this film about Civil War,

[00:07:59] about groups trying to overthrow our government, I think you could easily read into like, oh yeah, I know what this film is going to do.

[00:08:06] And I felt like it didn't do that.

[00:08:08] It kind of, to me, was a cautionary tale about we've seen scenes of civil unrest in other countries that have devolved into buildings being blown out

[00:08:21] and the nations, people within it fighting one another.

[00:08:25] I mean, Gaza, Israel, you know, those are two different nations.

[00:08:29] But that kind of fighting going on and tolls of human life.

[00:08:34] And but we've never seen in my lifetime obviously something like that happening in the United States.

[00:08:41] So I think it was kind of like a, hey, this is happening.

[00:08:46] I'm not going to make a bad guy and say these are the people that are bad.

[00:08:49] This is why they're bad.

[00:08:50] These people fighting bravely against it, basically making an overall statement, which is I think pretty much everyone would agree with war is bad.

[00:09:00] And that is nothing new.

[00:09:02] But setting it in a maybe not too distant future dystopian future of the man that to me had resonance simply because yes, we've seen things like plan of the apes where, you know, apes run the country and they come and they see spoiler alert.

[00:09:18] They get back to DC in the Tim Burton version and you see apes on the Lincoln Memorial.

[00:09:24] Okay, pair that with how the Lincoln Memorial is used in this film where basically it's a battleground and it ends up being having a missile launched at it and being exploited.

[00:09:36] Both fiction films both using shock value.

[00:09:41] But for some reason, even though that scene of a Lincoln Memorial being destroyed was in the trailer.

[00:09:47] The way it was played out and using the same is like, it's just upsetting to me.

[00:09:54] It was upsetting.

[00:09:56] And I think that that's what he was going for.

[00:09:59] And it, and it resonated with me.

[00:10:01] It sounds like with you.

[00:10:03] Well, here's my thing.

[00:10:05] It could have been aliens doing that.

[00:10:06] It could have been apes doing that.

[00:10:08] But that's what's disturbing is that it's not only human beings doing it, it's Americans doing it to each other.

[00:10:16] Yeah, again, this is what we have devolved down to.

[00:10:19] This is the sad state of affairs.

[00:10:22] And yeah, here's my thing.

[00:10:25] This movie could have been swapped out where it was,

[00:10:32] where it was invaders from another country who've infiltrated America and decided to try to overthrow it and they make efforts to overthrow it.

[00:10:40] And those movies had been done before.

[00:10:42] Exactly.

[00:10:44] The point of this film that's supposed to make you think is this is America fighting against itself.

[00:10:49] This is the sad state of affairs.

[00:10:51] But I never got a sense of that.

[00:10:53] And I think a lot of people didn't.

[00:10:55] A lot of people are condemning that.

[00:10:57] There's a lot of Americans.

[00:10:59] We see people that look like Americans that we believe are Americans, but there's no context to any of it.

[00:11:04] It's like you could have swapped it out.

[00:11:06] That's the whole point of the film.

[00:11:08] You could have told me that they were invasion of the body snatchers and these are just people that have like taken over and all of a sudden we're seeing them fight.

[00:11:16] And we're trying to follow these journalists across country.

[00:11:19] It becomes an episode of The Walking Dead.

[00:11:20] It's just okay.

[00:11:22] We're just watching to make sure they can get from point A to point B safely and not get killed.

[00:11:27] And there was just no, I didn't need an explanation of why the Civil War started.

[00:11:33] Didn't need that.

[00:11:35] I didn't need any background information, but I've got at least have some context of what this notion of a true Civil War is doing to these characters.

[00:11:43] And I got no sense of that.

[00:11:45] Really?

[00:11:47] You got none of that.

[00:11:48] The journalist, again, they could have been monitoring.

[00:11:51] They could have been watching a Russian invasion on American soil and they're covering it as press people.

[00:11:56] There's no difference.

[00:11:58] There was no difference.

[00:12:00] There was no context on why this needed to be called Civil War and this need to be a Civil War, a movie about a Civil War released today in 2024 as volatile.

[00:12:09] The definition of Civil War is a country fighting with itself.

[00:12:12] Exactly, but I never got a sense of why or that sense of the country fighting with itself.

[00:12:18] No, I mean it's truly it was a these people could have been anybody.

[00:12:25] And just because they look like Americans, that was the only thing that movie gave us.

[00:12:29] Okay.

[00:12:31] There was no understanding of what this kind of Civil War, why this was so impactful and why this was so detrimental other than people are now fighting for survival.

[00:12:42] That was the whole key is these four people that were following are trying to survive getting from point A to point B and there's so much more content that could have been mined out of this.

[00:12:53] And I just feel like it just skirted on the surface.

[00:12:55] It was more interested in showing the survival.

[00:12:58] I'll tell you what this film should have been because it would have been extremely successful if they just branded it or labeled and said, this is the point of the film.

[00:13:07] The field of photojournalism and war.

[00:13:10] Okay.

[00:13:12] Wartime photojournalist or journalist in general.

[00:13:15] That's the interesting part of this movie that in itself taking the toll on what these people who are trying to chronicle this regardless of who the attackers were regardless of what kind of conflict was going on them dealing with war and having to document or and trying to find the best way to share what's going on in this war.

[00:13:34] That's the movie.

[00:13:36] That's the interesting movie, but instead they decided to make this movie called Civil War and release it right now when I think our country is at a pretty volatile time anyway.

[00:13:47] Which I think is a good idea to release it now.

[00:13:50] I see why.

[00:13:52] Okay.

[00:13:53] I felt it was a little irresponsible to make it a movie about a civil war that had nothing to really say other than war is bad.

[00:14:04] That's the message I got from this war sucks.

[00:14:07] People died and it's dangerous and it's traumatic and it's upsetting, but it could have been a war with anybody and anything going on.

[00:14:15] I didn't get any context except for one scene.

[00:14:17] And it's the scene we see in the trailer.

[00:14:19] Jesse Plymons is in that scene.

[00:14:20] That is the only scene in the entire movie where I felt like it's trying to at least build some context on what the employer.

[00:14:29] And I appreciated that scene and I appreciate they're not being any more of it because that's just beating us over the head.

[00:14:33] And I think that's what people wanted.

[00:14:35] It seems like from the blowback I hear is they wanted a more stronger like this is the statement we're trying to make.

[00:14:41] This is why it's like, no, I think you can infer what's going on.

[00:14:48] There is that one statement that basically the Jesse Plymons scene comes right out and tells you, hey guys, this is this is an issue that apparently is going on.

[00:14:56] But they leave it at that.

[00:14:58] And I felt like that's what made, you know, like I said, it was a cautionary tale for me about how divisions things break down people and things break down.

[00:15:11] And it escalates into where society has gotten to this point in the United States.

[00:15:18] And that's what was so powerful for me.

[00:15:21] And actually another attack that I'll take is I like the fact that they can give us any more background that hit us over the head with any other messages or any side you can infer certain things.

[00:15:31] You start to feel like, OK, maybe this is the good side.

[00:15:34] Maybe this is what happened.

[00:15:36] But not only do they keep that apparently for many frustratingly vague.

[00:15:41] But I would actually push back a little bit on the journalist part, photo journalist part.

[00:15:49] Well, there's one guy who I think is a he is a writer or a journalist and the others are photo journalists.

[00:15:54] Or maybe two or two of the four photo, I think two or split half and half in journalists.

[00:16:00] Yeah.

[00:16:01] Right. So going in, I've been like the synopsis kind of says you follow these for these journalists, whether photo or written.

[00:16:11] I was like, OK.

[00:16:13] And in a traditional film, the setup would have been these are the heroes.

[00:16:20] OK, so maybe we don't have the good guys, bad guys in the government dynamic in the fighting size dynamic.

[00:16:26] But we have a these are our protagonists.

[00:16:29] But for me, it was not that simple.

[00:16:34] Because there are this person done to I think for the most part, even though detractors of the film, I think say that they did appreciate her performance.

[00:16:44] They thought and I'll start performances are all great.

[00:16:47] I agree as well.

[00:16:49] But I'll key in on her.

[00:16:51] I guess would you say she's like the lead actors lead?

[00:16:53] I thought she was great.

[00:16:56] And she they show other conflicts that she's been in as a photo journalist, her photographing times of war in other countries.

[00:17:04] And you see her eyesaw, the effect that it has on her and now that she is doing this in her own country.

[00:17:12] And there's a little bit of dialogue back and forth between her and somebody else who I he's getting to be one of these people that if I see that he's in a film and be like, OK,

[00:17:23] even though if this is a romantic comedy featuring Smurfs, I'm going to go see it because Stephen McKinley Henderson is amazing.

[00:17:32] I really wasn't that aware of him.

[00:17:34] You know, I know like people really was like, oh, he's in Dune and they got excited about that.

[00:17:37] And I guess I'd seen him, but I'd never really locked on after this film.

[00:17:41] It was in a bow is afraid also too.

[00:17:43] And yeah, it just but now like with this film, I feel like he really, I don't know.

[00:17:49] He was a very important character and there's Kirsten Dunn's character who's kind of the seasoned photo journalist.

[00:17:56] Then you have the other.

[00:17:58] There's like her companion guy Joel, who's a writer, but he's much younger than Stephen McKinley Henderson, who you get the sense that he's kind of at the end of his career.

[00:18:08] He's older.

[00:18:09] Get on the front lines is easier anymore because he's, you know, he's older.

[00:18:13] And then you have a Kayleigh Spani's character of Jesse and her character is the one that I really if you were wanting.

[00:18:23] She's a very interesting character and I need to see the film again to kind of get a better read on her.

[00:18:30] Because she's the younger inexperienced.

[00:18:34] She apparently has Kirsten Dunn's character kind of on a pedestal is somebody she admires because she's like this, you know, renowned or photographer and she comes in trying to take pictures and she sees her and they kind of befriend it and then they end up traveling together to get to the White House.

[00:18:50] But there are there are inferences that I made in the last scenes of the movie about how Jesse's care or Jesse, the character of Jesse reacts in some moments and I found it rather damning.

[00:19:10] I guess I should say it's damning on several characters France.

[00:19:13] Well, okay.

[00:19:14] Yes, there's her character and then actually the character of Joel damning both of their day.

[00:19:20] Whereas, um, yeah, and I found that like so there you were thinking like, oh, these journalists, they're admirable.

[00:19:27] They're doing but then I felt like there was a shift in a grant is their job to document things.

[00:19:32] But I don't know just the way it was portrayed.

[00:19:35] It made me appreciate the facts that Alex Garland, not, you know, you're saying he was making the obvious statement.

[00:19:40] Why do we need this movie to tell us or is bad?

[00:19:43] Um, but the way in which I felt like it was telling it in a complicated fashion and not only that, but the people that I guess you could say he kind of tricked you in a way.

[00:19:52] The journalist, which he was kind of giving you this thing like, okay, journalism is under pressure under fire.

[00:19:59] These people are being treated as like enemies other than so that valid.

[00:20:04] And he even said as much as an interview, he doesn't like the way journalism has been, you know, take out.

[00:20:07] But he didn't give them.

[00:20:10] I felt like at the end of the film, what I was mentioning about those two characters, Joel and Jesse, he didn't give them carte blanche either.

[00:20:17] Oh no, no, he kind of turned a critical eye on it.

[00:20:20] So I was like, wow, actually, I felt like there was a critical eye on their field the entire film.

[00:20:24] I mean, there were some glancing moments early on even where there is a just horrible, horrible scene to kick off the film that, you know, people dead on the street, you know, from a,

[00:20:37] from a situation.

[00:20:39] And what do we see?

[00:20:41] Yeah, but we see Lee, the Chris and Dunn's character walking around, stepping around them, taking photos.

[00:20:47] And it's shot in a way that it is damning.

[00:20:49] It's like this is what they do.

[00:20:51] This is their job.

[00:20:53] And there's they're now photographing the remnants of people who just lost their life like two minutes ago.

[00:20:57] But I get it.

[00:20:59] I mean, it's commentary on this career.

[00:21:02] And that's that's the movie I found fascinating.

[00:21:04] That's and again, it wasn't treating them as heroes.

[00:21:07] I never saw these four people as heroes.

[00:21:09] These people were going to get a story.

[00:21:13] They were going to travel to get a photograph.

[00:21:16] They were not going to do anything for the good of the nation.

[00:21:20] They're going because they want a photograph or a story or an interview by the end of the film.

[00:21:25] That's what they're going to do.

[00:21:27] And I get it.

[00:21:29] It's that's the fascinating film for me is these people putting their lives in the line.

[00:21:33] For their career, but their careers also preying on a horrible, horrible situation.

[00:21:39] And anyway, that's the fascinating film for me.

[00:21:43] That's the film I got away from it.

[00:21:45] If they had called this film, I don't know, some photographic term, some journalistic term, whatever.

[00:21:50] And it just so happens that it is taking place in a situation where yes, people in our country are fighting against each other and all that.

[00:21:58] I'm down with.

[00:21:59] I mean, this is that's a that's a excellent film.

[00:22:04] And it really by the end of it makes me think more about this, this notion of journalism and journalism during wartime and the role they play.

[00:22:14] That's the fascinating film.

[00:22:16] I'm just, I'm just, I can't help it feel like the title Civil War and all the press is getting about being who is this a, you know, precursor to what our world's in.

[00:22:29] And it's a little bit of a marketing got added to the film to try to hit a hit a hit a hit a touch point, hit a nerve with audiences to get them to come out and drive out.

[00:22:40] I don't feel like that's the film that's interested in telling.

[00:22:43] I think the film is about these these individuals that have a career based on trying to share images and words from these horrible situations with us.

[00:22:54] And that's the fascinating film part for me.

[00:22:57] So again, I love that film.

[00:23:00] I just I just really struggle with what I struggle with the purpose of it being called Civil War and being released at this time and trying to play off this idea of that's what the film is about because I did not get that.

[00:23:13] I got that it was about this role that these people play in our society and the impacts this whole situation had on them.

[00:23:22] So anyway, that's so yeah, I everything you're talking about there.

[00:23:27] I agree with and I never saw these four people as heroes.

[00:23:30] I saw them as the people were following and we're exploring their lives and the impact it's having on them.

[00:23:36] And that I thought was fascinating.

[00:23:39] So, yeah.

[00:23:41] Yeah.

[00:23:43] Yeah, it's it's okay.

[00:23:46] Yeah, it's interesting.

[00:23:48] We both saw the same which you know, point of criticism.

[00:23:51] We both saw the same film and it seems like yeah, I really like the film and the things you're coming down on it for.

[00:23:59] I don't know. It's strange.

[00:24:01] It's not even it's not even really coming down on it.

[00:24:04] I'm just I'm making my commentary on I do feel like I feel like maybe I'm guilty a little bit of preconceived notions because again when I hear a film that's supposed to be a film.

[00:24:17] It's going to be very kind of a commentary on kind of where we are as a society and the dangers of what could be happening.

[00:24:25] That's I mean, yeah, sure.

[00:24:27] I saw okay. Yeah, this sucks.

[00:24:29] This looks like bad.

[00:24:31] This is people are dying and people are hurting.

[00:24:33] But I didn't get any context why this being a quote civil war was any different than people turning into zombies and now we're fighting the zombies as we try to get to Washington D.C.

[00:24:44] Or it's Russian invaders coming in and taking over parts of America and we're having to try to battle against them.

[00:24:50] I didn't get any other context for why this needed to be about a civil war.

[00:24:56] And that's what was a little disappointing to me because I felt like there was such an opportunity to make more of a commentary, not a good or bad, not giving me sides.

[00:25:07] I don't need an explanation of why this happened.

[00:25:10] I don't need a these are good people.

[00:25:12] These are bad people.

[00:25:14] Barring a couple lines of dialogue and a couple like minor scenes, especially that one with Jesse Plyman's.

[00:25:20] That's the only thing I got from it that had any sense of context to help me process like why I should feel or why I should be responding to in this film.

[00:25:33] So yeah. Yeah.

[00:25:35] But I mean, technically, it's amazing.

[00:25:38] Okay. I think it is probably one of the most harrowing films I've seen.

[00:25:44] I would agree with that.

[00:25:46] Tense, just brutal, thick of it, you know, realism on what you're seeing and what you're experiencing.

[00:25:57] It's probably the closest I've ever felt to feeling like one of these main characters in a film watching what's going around me.

[00:26:03] So from all those standpoints.

[00:26:05] Yes, it was.

[00:26:06] I don't recoil from films too often unless there's like body hard things that we've talked about.

[00:26:13] But this is the film I honestly found myself not wanting, like having to divert my eyes away from times because I'm like, yeah, I don't know what's going to happen.

[00:26:22] And I don't know what situation they're finding themselves in.

[00:26:25] And that's a credit to the filmmakers.

[00:26:27] I mean, they elicited that sense from me, which is crazy and amazing.

[00:26:32] So yeah, so technically, look, I if you go into it because you want to see a film that I feel like is harrowing in tense and and very feels very real and feels very tactile.

[00:26:53] And just this is this is an amazing film for that.

[00:26:55] I just if somebody is going in looking for some sort of like a deep socio commentary on our society and what, you know, what a civil war could trigger mean for our.

[00:27:08] I just I don't feel like I got that.

[00:27:11] And just that's just kind of my my fair warning to people going into this.

[00:27:16] Look, I best I can reflect to it as I've had several members or our film society say, oh, we should bring this film.

[00:27:22] We should bring this film.

[00:27:23] Like, first off, no, I think this film is it's brutal.

[00:27:27] It is extremely brutal film tough to watch.

[00:27:30] But honestly for me, Chris, and I know we may differ on this.

[00:27:34] I don't know what I can really talk about afterwards in a discussion about this film except for the things that have to do with what I talked about the world of photo journalism or journalism and wartime and the technical side of the films, which again,

[00:27:53] is incredibly engaging and amazing.

[00:27:55] But I know people are going to want to talk about the fact that it's called civil war.

[00:28:00] And I don't really I don't feel like the film gave us a lot to to work with on that.

[00:28:04] So anyway, yeah, we've talked about the things we could champion.

[00:28:09] The sound design on the cinematography.

[00:28:11] There's a scene with people going into a forest.

[00:28:16] Well, it's a forest fire type with floating embers everywhere.

[00:28:19] And I thought that was amazing.

[00:28:20] The version of DC that's just this haunted hollered out version of DC that they show very effective.

[00:28:27] There's a scene with a golf course and some Christmas decorations blowing around.

[00:28:32] Also, Garland, I feel like in some of these other films that I mentioned, men and I like next morning that he cinematography and just the look of his films.

[00:28:44] He excels at it with the cinematography.

[00:28:47] Yes.

[00:28:48] And this was absolutely no, no different.

[00:28:52] I felt like different in that I don't feel like well, yeah, I mean, it's just a surprising for him because these other ones all had some element of sci fi first 2x mock and annihilation men was, I guess more of a horror type thing fantasy.

[00:29:10] But this just kind of stripped all that away and didn't have any of those elements at all.

[00:29:14] This was more of just like a intense drama.

[00:29:19] And yeah, it worked for me and it sounds like to a lesser effect for you.

[00:29:25] It worked for me just in a different way than I think I feel like I was expecting or a lot of other people I think would be expecting with this film.

[00:29:33] So it worked for me on what I was able to take away from it and what I decided to see it and the lens of.

[00:29:39] So yeah, in that regard, I thought it was amazing.

[00:29:41] So yeah, I guess.

[00:29:45] And I did clearly if you've been listening, you can tell the differences between how you and I like receive the film.

[00:29:53] And I think for me unforgiving, unforgettable, gripping gruesome cautionary masterpiece.

[00:30:02] And that's what it was for me.

[00:30:04] It may be I initially walking out was like, that's a one timer that an all timer one timer.

[00:30:12] However, now because of a lot of the discussions I've had and like talking with other people, I do want to see it again to try now that I kind of know the outside story.

[00:30:22] I want to follow like journal, the journalist actions and see if my read on the characters actually plays out because it is so tense that a lot of times you kind of like you're kind of dull.

[00:30:33] Okay, what what's happening and like the progression.

[00:30:36] I feel like I do need to see it again to get a read on it.

[00:30:38] But it for me very traumatizing, tough set, but a worthwhile one.

[00:30:44] No, and I'm with you on on.

[00:30:46] I agree with you on every word you described it.

[00:30:49] The only one I think you and I just differ on is the cautionary word again.

[00:30:56] That's just because I feel like, yes, if you go into this assuming, okay, I know this is about a civil war and I'm going to go ahead in my head.

[00:31:03] I'm going to have a mental idea of what this means.

[00:31:06] Then he has to film does show you what this could look like.

[00:31:10] And unless you like that, that's cautionary to me.

[00:31:15] I mean, like, you know, it's like, oh, what does it matter that we had disagreeing factions and journalists are called liars and there's fake news and you cannot tell what's real.

[00:31:23] What's not real.

[00:31:25] Okay.

[00:31:27] This is where this could end up.

[00:31:28] Unless you see it and you think, oh, that's cool.

[00:31:31] That's a good idea, which hopefully I don't think anyone seeing this would think like, yeah, that's cool.

[00:31:37] That's totally what should happen in any nation or the United States.

[00:31:41] Like that's cool.

[00:31:43] Hopefully not that many people are okay with that vision of a country.

[00:31:50] So hopefully not.

[00:31:52] Yeah.

[00:31:53] And so that I do that to me is cautionary just like when you watch, I never watched this series, but the man in the high tower where they kind of what if what if Nazis had never lost World War Two and that kind of thing.

[00:32:04] It's like, or you know, handmade stale that type stuff about, you know, abortion women not being able to, there's, you know, subservient to men and they don't can't control what happens with their pregnancies and all this kind of stuff.

[00:32:14] Like, yeah, those those are like cautionary like, hey guys, you know, and so this to me, but and you know, I, you know, obviously effectiveness or appreciation of it.

[00:32:23] It varies.

[00:32:24] But yeah, for me it worked.

[00:32:27] Well, that is Civil War.

[00:32:30] Yeah.

[00:32:31] I mean, it's a, again, I think we're both, we're both saying there this is a excellently made film.

[00:32:38] It's just what you decide or feel like you can take away from it.

[00:32:41] There are some differences from it and opinions on that.

[00:32:44] But again, I think that makes for good film discussion.

[00:32:47] So when that happens.

[00:32:49] Yeah.

[00:32:50] So Civil War is doing, I mean, I hate saying it's doing really good box office.

[00:32:56] It's a shame to say I don't like saying that because I think this is this is not a film that really needs to chalk up box office to like be considered successful.

[00:33:04] But you know, it is, it is attracting an audience and I think people are going out to see it.

[00:33:10] So that's probably the biggest box office wise that Alex Garland's ever seen from I can imagine, right?

[00:33:16] I think so.

[00:33:17] And I think I heard over the weekend too that there's and I don't know what film that there's open big, but neon and I don't know if they did.

[00:33:27] What lies bleeding or maybe they did something.

[00:33:29] But like all the Lionsgate had one neon had a big opening film and a 24 who has had I think everything everywhere all at once was supposed to like good.

[00:33:39] But I don't know if the opening weekend of that film was big.

[00:33:42] Right.

[00:33:43] So the opening weekend for Civil War was like huge.

[00:33:46] I think maybe a 24 is most successful opening weekend.

[00:33:50] Now, I think will it gross as much as you know, which that's not what's important, but just as far as like how audiences are responding to films.

[00:33:57] But yeah, I mean, Civil War had a $25 million opening, which again, the best ever for a 24.

[00:34:03] So definitely the best ever for Alex Garland's one of his films.

[00:34:06] So yeah, I mean, 25 million.

[00:34:08] It's a good it's a good opening weekend.

[00:34:11] It was number one of the box office, which is again, whatever that may say on whatever front.

[00:34:17] Well, who knows?

[00:34:18] But interesting stuff.

[00:34:20] All right.

[00:34:21] Well, that is Civil War.

[00:34:23] Yeah, I'm recommending Chris's recommending.

[00:34:26] I recommend with some caveats.

[00:34:28] Chris is recommending.

[00:34:30] Holy it sounds like so.

[00:34:32] Yeah, I mean, obviously this maybe you know, you can infer from our discussion.

[00:34:36] It's real very realistic, very graphic, very violent.

[00:34:40] So probably one of the more.

[00:34:42] Yeah, it's one of the more harrowing films up.

[00:34:44] And so it is I'm not recommending it for everyone.

[00:34:46] Not a general recommendation like go around and see it.

[00:34:49] But and I will say too, if you are sensitive or not sensitive, I guess it's not a good word.

[00:34:56] But if you're you don't want to hear any more discussions about the state of our country, you're just you're kind of worn down and you're overwhelmed with that.

[00:35:04] Yeah, don't you can probably infer.

[00:35:06] Yeah, probably skip this because it's not going to.

[00:35:09] It's not going to make you feel good.

[00:35:12] This is not it.

[00:35:13] You know, it's probably going to depress you and make you think which was good for me.

[00:35:16] But I can see how some people are like, you know, I'm going to skip that.

[00:35:19] And I do not blame anyone at all.

[00:35:22] That's true.

[00:35:23] So yeah, I do recommend it, but it's, you know, it has caveat as well like you're saying.

[00:35:28] All right.

[00:35:29] All right.

[00:35:30] Well, that's Civil War still playing movie theaters near you and probably will be for a little while here.

[00:35:35] So Chris, let's take a quick break when we come back.

[00:35:38] We've got a couple of I think one news item, one trailer and one recommendation to kind of share with the audience.

[00:35:44] So we will get into all that in just a minute.

[00:35:47] Stay tuned.

[00:35:48] You're listening to foot candle films here on the mesh dot TV will be right back.

[00:35:52] This podcast is sponsored by Jackson creative, a custom communication agency located in downtown

[00:35:58] Hickory, North Carolina specializing in online content creation to learn more.

[00:36:04] Visit the Jackson creative.com Jackson creative.

[00:36:08] We tell your story.

[00:36:11] Welcome back to foot candle films here on the mesh dot TV Alan Jackson, Chris Fry with you here after our discussion of Civil War and believe me, the

[00:36:20] discussion continued even while the micro not rolling because you know it is.

[00:36:25] Yeah, it's a it's a discussion worthy topic depending on where what kind of discussion you're looking to get into.

[00:36:33] But let's move on to some other things.

[00:36:35] Let's move away from let's move away from the harrowing world and idea of a Civil War instead.

[00:36:41] Let's go to the harrowing and scary world of the apocalypse.

[00:36:46] So Chris, that's the film I'm going to tell you about.

[00:36:49] Yeah, I know I didn't plan for this to be back to back, but here we are.

[00:36:53] But at least this one is a musical about the apocalypse.

[00:36:57] So we got that going for it.

[00:36:59] Have are you familiar with the film that's in production right now called the end?

[00:37:03] No.

[00:37:04] Okay, let me tell you a little bit about this film because I came across my radar and intrigued on several fronts.

[00:37:12] Let's talk first about the premise I just shared with you.

[00:37:16] The tagline for this film that's being produced right now is called a golden age style musical about the last human family.

[00:37:25] Okay, so take that as the as the topic, the theme.

[00:37:29] Okay.

[00:37:30] Now let me share with you the cast that are attached to this.

[00:37:34] You have Michael Shannon, Tilda Swinton, George McKay, which you may recognize or remember him from the Sam Mindy's film was at 1912.

[00:37:45] The War, Warfell or 1917.

[00:37:47] 1917.

[00:37:48] Okay.

[00:37:50] And then there's Lenny James, who I mentioned the walking dead during our review of Civil War.

[00:37:54] He is a cast member on that and you would have recognized him in some other things as well.

[00:37:59] Moses Ingram, somebody else you will probably recognize if you saw Tim McInery again, a lot of faces that I guarantee you would recognize these are all really good actors.

[00:38:09] Okay.

[00:38:11] So that's interesting in itself.

[00:38:14] The cast sounds really interesting.

[00:38:16] I like a lot of these performers are really like Tilda Swinton, Michael Shannon always kind of curious to see what they're doing.

[00:38:22] Here's the catcher for me.

[00:38:24] The director is a Mr. Joshua Oppenheimer.

[00:38:28] And how do you know that name Chris?

[00:38:30] That's something of killing.

[00:38:34] The act of killing and the look of silence.

[00:38:36] There we go.

[00:38:37] Yeah.

[00:38:38] Those two documentaries.

[00:38:39] But now this is a dramatic film being directed.

[00:38:43] So a golden age musical about the apocalypse following the world's last standing family with Michael Shannon, Tilda Swinton and George McKay in this film.

[00:38:55] So any immediate thought reaction?

[00:38:59] Again, this is something that just stumbled across my newsline like this weekend.

[00:39:03] I mean obviously first of all kind of odd.

[00:39:06] Any musical what it comes down to is the quality of the music.

[00:39:14] Do I remember the songs when I walk out of theater?

[00:39:17] Do I like them?

[00:39:19] To me, it's going to be kind of a hard sell to be doing a musical about the end of the world or the last human because it's just so depressing now making it a musical.

[00:39:31] But if it's kind of like Lars von Trier, Dancer in the Dark.

[00:39:36] I mean I guess I'll see it but I don't really.

[00:39:39] But I don't see Joshua Oppenheimer as being a very comedic director.

[00:39:45] His first two documentaries definitely didn't give any sense of comedy.

[00:39:49] So yeah, like a dark comedy musical.

[00:39:54] Okay that might be a little bit more palatable maybe.

[00:39:58] Well I'm not even sure if this is going for comedy.

[00:40:00] That's what I'm saying.

[00:40:01] Yeah, not having seen it like so.

[00:40:03] I yeah that is surprising.

[00:40:06] I mean Tilda Swinton, Michael Shannon, yeah you know but I.

[00:40:10] Well here's just a little blurb.

[00:40:12] This is all from IMDB.

[00:40:14] It says Joshua Oppenheimer describes this film as an exploration of whether we as human beings can come to a place where our guilt is too much to recover from our past.

[00:40:26] A little more description on the storyline.

[00:40:28] A post-apocalyptic story about a rich family living in a salt mine converted into a luxurious home.

[00:40:34] The earth around them has apparently been destroyed but their son has never seen the outside world.

[00:40:39] As a young girl appears at the entrance of the bunker, the balance of the family is threatened.

[00:40:45] So you know again if I didn't hear the director I'd be like well it sounds interesting.

[00:40:51] I mean Tilda Swinton typically is in good things.

[00:40:54] I think Michael Shannon typically also signs on good projects so the two of them together I'd like to see this performance.

[00:41:00] I'd like to see the story that the premise sounds interesting.

[00:41:03] You add Joshua Oppenheimer again I'm always fascinated when a documentarian switches over into narrative.

[00:41:10] I'm like all right I want to see what they do there can they make that transition.

[00:41:14] His documentary is political minded.

[00:41:17] So it sounds like this one is you know obviously you have this the apocalypse has happened and people like guilt or whatever about the past actually.

[00:41:25] So probably going to be pretty heavy.

[00:41:28] I would assume so.

[00:41:29] Sorry to bring this up after our discussion of Civil War but that was the film that kind of came across my line this weekend.

[00:41:35] Right but I mean maybe the way I was touting some of that like you know it's cautionary maybe this a cautionary musical.

[00:41:41] Okay.

[00:41:42] Yeah.

[00:41:43] It seems like an interesting project.

[00:41:46] Yeah.

[00:41:47] I'm very intrigued.

[00:41:49] When do we know any of the not so early 2025 so we're still like nine months away but I think all the casting announcements have been like come out the last month or two.

[00:41:58] So I would imagine productions going on later here in spring summer and we'll see it in first of 2025.

[00:42:06] Okay.

[00:42:07] All right Chris I think you have a trailer to share with us right.

[00:42:12] Yeah I do it just premiered I think at one of the not fest I don't think it was a festival but it's like some premiere event they have all these other movies that they kind of like showed trailers it wasn't like Comic Con but something like that.

[00:42:24] I was not invited but but I saw the trailer roll across social media for kinds of kindness and it's the latest film from a Yorgo slanty miss and it stars Emma Stone who obviously was also in poor things.

[00:42:37] Well, I'm going to throw you mentioned somebody that was also in Civil War and I'm blanking on who that was.

[00:42:42] Jesse Flemons.

[00:42:43] Okay.

[00:42:44] So there you go.

[00:42:45] Yep.

[00:42:46] All right so here's the teaser short teaser for kinds of kindness.

[00:42:52] This is what you want to show this short trailer is just a teaser as well we have right.

[00:42:56] Okay here we go then.

[00:42:59] This is it.

[00:43:02] The moment of truth.

[00:43:07] Oh.

[00:43:38] Isn't it wonderful.

[00:43:43] Yes very short little teaser trailer there for kinds of kindness basically lets you know all the different actors.

[00:43:51] The actors in a little bit a little bit of the vibe of the film but you know again with Lanthimos sometimes maybe a little hard to tell from a little 45 second trailer.

[00:44:02] What I'm intrigued about I mean like I'm a Lanthimos fan I think I've liked every one of his movies really was a fan of poor things.

[00:44:14] Still not quite as good as the lobster to me lobster still my probably my favorite of his films but I'm sure is also my favorite.

[00:44:20] You'd never saw killing of a sacred deer.

[00:44:22] That's the one I haven't seen.

[00:44:23] Yeah, that's the one I haven't seen but you've seen the Alps.

[00:44:26] Yes.

[00:44:27] Okay and you saw dog too.

[00:44:28] Both those.

[00:44:29] Yeah.

[00:44:30] And I like all of them so yeah but definitely well in the face I'd say I'd say lobster.

[00:44:37] Poor things the favorite that's kind of my top three of his what I like about this this teaser is it's stylistically and like time period and all that very very different than anything we've seen of his which is cool.

[00:44:53] I mean there's been other things in modern day but it's always been in a very odd.

[00:44:59] This doesn't look like a heightened version exactly right.

[00:45:02] It looks like reality.

[00:45:04] Yeah, but yeah modern day but a Lanthimos version of it which and of course even weaving in the music and it being very poppy music which I'm not used to hearing in any of his movies so true.

[00:45:14] That's I like the fact that it's a little different but I also know we're in for something kind of unique with this so what little I know of the film.

[00:45:24] Is that if I'm not mistaken which is interesting because at one time they show the title of the film on screen three different like kinds of kindness kind of like it's on screen written three different times.

[00:45:35] Is that they're going to be three different stories but the actors same actors which you know there was a laundry list of people and it Jesse Plemons Emma Stone.

[00:45:46] William Defoe Margaret quality which I'll be interested to see if I like her performance and this is supposed to drive away dolls but all these different people but they're playing different characters in each of the stories.

[00:45:57] Does that make sense so it's like it's like three different stories but then like one maybe husband or wife will be these people and then the next one they'll be like and they're like playing different so it's like.

[00:46:06] Oh interesting.

[00:46:07] Short stories but you use the same kind of like it's the Wes Anderson Henry sugar type deal where he made it short so kind of that idea but obviously dark.

[00:46:18] So yeah I'm I'm interested to see what it is.

[00:46:22] No I'm on board with it I think yes it's got all the right ingredients I like I like the cast is already involved in it I like Lanthimos as a director.

[00:46:31] I like the vibe of this teaser I'm like yeah and I'm excited June which is I mean we just have poor things like and then poor things came out last fall.

[00:46:42] Like just you know like nine months ago or seven months ago.

[00:46:46] Sure.

[00:46:47] Wow.

[00:46:48] Yeah that's pretty pretty quick but he and he and Emma Stone seem to have a good actor director dynamic going on here they work together in the favorite obviously in poor things and now this film as well so.

[00:47:01] Very interested to see this film me looking forward to it.

[00:47:05] All right that is kinds of kindness yes June 21st and select theaters coming up soon already on that one.

[00:47:12] All right so Chris let's wrap this up with a recommendation so you've got a film that you're going to recommend for us that you think we ought to spend some time checking out and catching up with what do you have for us.

[00:47:23] So normally I do films I am going to break the rule this time because this would be a really long film and that would be 408 minutes so it's not a film but it's a limited series that Alex Garland did back in 2020.

[00:47:39] It's called Devs it is streaming on Hulu all eight episodes it stars Nick Offerman and Kylie Svaney and Stephen McKinley Henderson so all three of those people that were in Civil War are in this.

[00:47:52] The premise a young computer engineer Lily Chan investigates the secret development division of her employer a cutting edge tech company based in San Francisco which she believes is behind the murder of her boyfriend.

[00:48:05] And that said murder takes place in the first episode and then things play out Nick Offerman plays the his character name is Forrest.

[00:48:17] He's kind of like the Bill Gates or the Mark Zuckerberg of this company.

[00:48:23] The company is called Amaya which he is named after his daughter and the division in this ultra secretive division in this company is called Devs.

[00:48:33] So it's like a developer you know it's like the visual style that we talked about we appreciated in all of Alex Garland's films it's here as well.

[00:48:44] The complicated kind of storylines are just like characters and kind of like obsession with technology that wasn't really in Civil War but definitely was there an ex machina and a little bit in an isolation science fiction thing obviously very much a part of this.

[00:49:02] I really liked it I'm struggling with the ending.

[00:49:07] I liked I thought the ending was interesting.

[00:49:10] I'm not sure if I really liked it or if you know this is one of those things that kind of like lost which that went on for several seasons and I was a huge fan of it.

[00:49:19] But then when they ended it was kind of but you just like such a big challenge to find a satisfying ending.

[00:49:26] So I don't know if I felt like the end of Devs was completely satisfying but it was definitely interesting.

[00:49:33] And I just yeah Alex Garland and he's one of those that I don't know how I miss this when maybe I didn't have Hulu who made this why I didn't see it when it came out in 2020.

[00:49:42] I heard people talk about it but this was just like completely in my wheelhouse so it's Devs DEVS by Alex Garland and that as far as I'm aware of that series.

[00:49:53] And the four films that we've mentioned previously like that's his output right now and it's pretty pretty promising.

[00:50:01] So he's unbeknownst to me men was the one I was a little lower on but I still you know I really like that one there.

[00:50:08] So yeah you should yeah you should you should know I definitely been mean to check out that show of it's on a my what my ever growing super long watch list it's on there somewhere on that list.

[00:50:20] Coming off Civil War while I was talking about how much I liked Stephen McKinley Henderson and not really having seen him play like a big role and he was you know kind of a supporting character in that pretty good.

[00:50:31] And then devs again he's not one of the main people he's not son of Mizuno who plays Lily and he's not Nick Hoffman but he's a supporting character and he's very very key and very important so yeah devs.

[00:50:46] Alright there we go that is the recommendation Chris jumping outside the box just a little bit to go with the show but you know having a limited number of episodes you can kind of consider it.

[00:50:56] Consider it a large along movie yeah alright well that is our show for today so again we had our discussion about Alex Garland Civil War Chris did a recommendation of Alex Garland show devs.

[00:51:07] We talked about the latest teaser trailer and upcoming film from your ghost latin most called kinds of kindness and then I also shared the news about Joshua Oppenheimer's first narrative feature film called the end coming out early 2025.

[00:51:25] Little bit of a depressing episode to for us to talk about topics wise but that's okay you know it's we'll try to we'll try to keep it light maybe we can.

[00:51:33] I don't know do we have a good dumb superhero movie coming out soon or something like that.

[00:51:38] Comedy romantic we'll find something I'm sure soon so Chris anybody who wants to follow up with us talk with us or interested in the festival we've got coming up this fall where can they get info or what's going on there.

[00:51:51] You can send an email to input foot candle foot candle dot org you can follow us on Twitter at foot candle film Facebook run there's foot candle film society Instagram and threads run there's foot candle film.

[00:52:03] Alan I are also on letterbox we try to track what we're seeing and leave quicker views do us a favor if you like the show consider giving us a star rating writer of you share friends or whatever service you receive your favorite podcast on because it could help us reach new listeners which we'd appreciate.

[00:52:18] And also if you're interested in learning more about the film festival that Alan mentioned our 2024 foot candle film festival will be September 20th through the 28th.

[00:52:28] We'd love to have you come join us here in Hickory, North Carolina Western North Carolina it'll be our 10th annual film festival so we're thinking it's going to be our best yet.

[00:52:37] Absolutely.

[00:52:38] We're certainly looking forward to it.

[00:52:40] Alright well thanks everybody for listening today and we look forward to getting with everybody again very soon take care and thanks.

[00:52:47] See you in a ticket line.

[00:53:10] Special thanks to Carpal Tuller for the show theme music. For more about Carpal Tuller visit www dot Carpal Tuller dot com.